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Lotte
Pathfinder
United Kingdom
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August 08 2006
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 Posted - August 22 2006 : 2:13:00 PM
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For starters, I think that Uncas loved Alice; he did die for her after all. I also think that Alice loved Uncas.  *Dodges rifle fire* Simple as that.
What proof do I have? Not much really... Although, and so what if I'm reading too much into this, in the scenes after Uncas pulled Alice away from the waterfall, which would also be after the 'love scene' she has a plait/braid in her hair. Where did this come from? Maybe she wore it as a sign of her affection for Uncas, or perhaps Uncas did it because they had come to some sort of agreement, or perhaps - and this is like throwing myself off the cliff and saving you lot the trouble of shooting me  - Alice plaited her own hair in the waterfall because she was bored in her own little world and because the make-up artists thought it would look good. Lol, this is all just speculation anyway and completely off the point of the original post.
I suppose – now I’m handing you my own rifle for you to shoot me with – the whole dying for each other thing was a bit out of the blue. However, the romantic side in me would see it that Alice did love Uncas, why else would she jump off the cliff after him if not because she couldn’t bear to live her life without him. It's also the eighteenth century so when Uncas stares at Alice and holds her under the waterfalls that would be considered quite improper, Alice is not so stupid as to not realise that Uncas has feelings for her. The only logical thing for her to do is to like him obviously (she’d be mad not to!) and this can be seen when they look at each other on the cliffs. I can see why people don’t think that Alice loved Uncas but then hasn’t Uncas just given his life up for nothing - that’s just too tragic for me… *sob* 
To conclude, finally I can hear you all say, I don't think that the Alice/Uncas relationship should be magically erased because otherwise I wouldn’t be sitting here speculating about a subplot in a film  lol… I’ll go volunteer myself to be burned on a Huron fire now… 
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Irishgirl
Council of Elders
USA
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Posted - August 22 2006 : 5:36:30 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Lurking Huron6170
Seriously i think that Mr. mann should have elaborated more on the uncas/alice relationship... if nathanial died and cora jumped off i would have understood... buit the uncas/alice relationship is super unexplained... i certainly want mr mann to include the deleted scenes of their romance...
Totally agree with what you say LH
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Light of the Moon
Mohicanland Statesman
USA
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Posted - September 28 2006 : 08:54:11 AM
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eh, I live by...If it ain't broke don't fix it! I love the movie just as it is but will admitt it would make more sense if there was some building relationship shown btwn Alice and Uncas. I mean, could they have let him speak? A little? A lot? Come on! All we got was a few swooning expressions! What a rip!
Totally agree with what you say LH
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I live in my own little world - but that's okay, they know me here! |
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Obediah
Mohicanland Statesman
USA
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Posted - October 03 2006 : 8:08:05 PM
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Yeah, Uncas did seem to be in love with Alice; at least he made quite a few Goo-Goo Eyes at her. BUT...Alice certainly didn't return those feelings. What proper Brit/Scot maiden could fall in love with a "savage Indian?"
Oh well, we're just talking about a movie, not historical accuracy.
"If it ain't broke, don't break it!" |
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Lotte
Pathfinder
United Kingdom
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Posted - October 04 2006 : 12:39:50 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Obediah
What proper Brit/Scot maiden could fall in love with a "savage Indian?"
Cora fell in love with Hawkeye, and she was a 'proper Brit maiden'. Even if she was a bit unorthodox and only Alice's half sister, she was still brought up in the same way as Alice. Seeing as Hawkeye was Uncas' brother then he could also be called a 'savage Indian'. I'm sticking by my guns, Alice loved Uncas.
Believe me, any 'proper Brit/Scot maiden' would quite easily fall in love with someone like Uncas!   |
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Irishgirl
Council of Elders
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Posted - October 04 2006 : 1:09:28 PM
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| It never said in the movie that they were half-sisters or did I miss something the numerous times I have seen it? |
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Lotte
Pathfinder
United Kingdom
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Posted - October 04 2006 : 2:26:35 PM
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| My mistake, they were half sisters in the novel. |
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Obediah
Mohicanland Statesman
USA
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Posted - October 04 2006 : 11:41:52 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Lotte
(Big Snip)
Believe me, any 'proper Brit/Scot maiden' would quite easily fall in love with someone like Uncas!
Would not! |
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Lotte
Pathfinder
United Kingdom
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Posted - October 05 2006 : 11:00:28 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Obediah
Would not!
Would so!
Seeing as you're neither British (well you could be British but you live in the US so I'll take it you're American) nor a maiden (at least I hope not!) then how can you say 'a proper Brit/Scot maiden' wouldn't fall in love with someone like Uncas?
 Uncas and Alice - so there!
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Light of the Moon
Mohicanland Statesman
USA
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Posted - October 05 2006 : 8:40:32 PM
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[quote]Originally posted by Obediah
Yeah, Uncas did seem to be in love with Alice; at least he made quite a few Goo-Goo Eyes at her. BUT...Alice certainly didn't return those feelings.
What?!
I guess she cried over his final moments and lept from the mtn for nothing. Bummer!
Can someone get Obediah a thermometer and a psychiatrist! |
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Obediah
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USA
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Posted - October 06 2006 : 11:40:21 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Lotte
quote:
Originally posted by Obediah
Would not!
Would so!
Seeing as you're neither British (well you could be British but you live in the US so I'll take it you're American) nor a maiden (at least I hope not!) then how can you say 'a proper Brit/Scot maiden' wouldn't fall in love with someone like Uncas?
Uncas and Alice - so there!
Would not! This is starting to sound like we're about 6 years old...
I assume you're British since you live in the UK. I'll make no comments about the 'maiden' part. BUT...I'm sure you weren't born in 1740! So perhaps I should have phrased it 'a proper Brit/Scott maiden of the 18th century.' Believe me, Europeans of that era (especially the English) had very little respect for Indians. Even the French (who treated the tribes much better) called them "les Sauvages".
quote:
Originally posted by Light of the Moon
What?!
I guess she cried over his final moments and lept from the mtn for nothing. Bummer!
Can someone get Obediah a thermometer and a psychiatrist!
Alice might not have jumped if Magua (the dummy) hadn't motioned to her with his bloody hand! I might have jumped, myself! 
Now, young lady, any more cracks of that 'thermometer/psychiatrist' nature, and I'll take you over my knee and give you a good spanking!  |
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Lotte
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United Kingdom
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Posted - October 06 2006 : 12:30:32 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Obediah
Would not! This is starting to sound like we're about 6 years old...
Yeah, but everyone knows six year olds rock! lol
quote:
Originally posted by Obediah
I assume you're British since you live in the UK. I'll make no comments about the 'maiden' part. BUT...I'm sure you weren't born in 1740!
True, I am British, likewise no comment on the 'maiden' part but I must say I think it is rather astounding that you figured out that I wasn't born in 1740! Lol, just kidding
quote:
Originally posted by Obediah
So perhaps I should have phrased it 'a proper Brit/Scott maiden of the 18th century.' Believe me, Europeans of that era (especially the English) had very little respect for Indians. Even the French (who treated the tribes much better) called them "les Sauvages".
I know that in your post you meant maidens of the 18th century, I just though I'd pick up on the fact that you didn't specify.
I'm quite ready to accept that they did find Indians savages back then. But as you said, we're just talking about a movie, not historical accuracy so I'm entitled to believe what I want...
Uncas and Alice
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Light of the Moon
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USA
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Posted - October 09 2006 : 9:42:45 PM
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Posted by Obi B Juan
Now, young lady, any more cracks of that 'thermometer/psychiatrist' nature, and I'll take you over my knee and give you a good spanking! [/size=2]
[/quote]
You don't scare me! I've ran from smaller people than you before! |
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Obediah
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USA
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Posted - October 10 2006 : 12:12:25 AM
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quote:
quote:
Originally posted by Light of the Moon
Posted by Obi B Juan
Now, young lady, any more cracks of that 'thermometer/psychiatrist' nature, and I'll take you over my knee and give you a good spanking! [/size=2]
You don't scare me! I've ran from smaller people than you before!
I not that small! But considering you're half my age, I'm sure you're faster...
PS. For any of you who are reading this & wondering about the "Obi Juan" reference, it refers to "Obi Juan Kenobi - The Hispanic Jedi", since my name has been shortened to "Obi," get it? ... Oh never mind... |
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Light of the Moon
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USA
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Posted - October 11 2006 : 09:03:57 AM
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Well, you may not be that short but I'm an inch under six feet.
And yeah, I do run fast (long legs).
But don't let it fool ya'. Tae Kwan Do has recently been a favorite past time. Made a black belt run from me a month ago...no seriously, I really did! Close to getting mine soon!! |
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Irishgirl
Council of Elders
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Posted - October 11 2006 : 09:36:00 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Light of the Moon
Well, you may not be that short but I'm an inch under six feet.
And yeah, I do run fast (long legs).
 Wow as they say in the tennis world "you're a big babe" Light.  Best not stand next to you anytime soon. At five feet 6 inches I am not short but next to an Amazon  I would appear that way Good luck with the Black Belt 
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Obediah
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Posted - October 11 2006 : 10:30:44 AM
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Didn't Uncas like only short girls?
Yeah, I'm sure he did... |
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Light of the Moon
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USA
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Posted - October 11 2006 : 8:47:05 PM
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Yeah, I really do look like an amazon, always thought so. Made it hard to find a date when I was younger.
As for Uncas and short women, I can beat him into submission! "You will love me, dang it!"
Uncas replies : Quick, where's the back door? |
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Lady of Glencairn
Colonial Settler
South Africa
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May 29 2004
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Posted - November 01 2006 : 06:17:08 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Obediah
Yeah, Uncas did seem to be in love with Alice; at least he made quite a few Goo-Goo Eyes at her. BUT...Alice certainly didn't return those feelings. What proper Brit/Scot maiden could fall in love with a "savage Indian?"
Oh well, we're just talking about a movie, not historical accuracy.
"If it ain't broke, don't break it!"
I take it you havent read a Cassie Edwards novel?? In her books women fall for the 'savages' like flies. But oh well ... that certainly isnt historically correct either ... 
And for Light ... your lsat post was HILARIOUS!! |
Lady of Glencairn
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RedFraggle
Mohicanite
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Posted - November 01 2006 : 08:04:45 AM
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Okay, here's my two cents:
I think Uncas definitely had feelings for Alice--consider his goo goo eyes, after all! --but I'm not so sure Alice was in love. She spends most of the movie, even when she's in Uncas' arms under the waterfall (!), looking shocked and confused. She's clearly a very sheltered girl, and I think she would probably look to Uncas as a protector rather than a lover. He's the only member of the party who shows an active interest in protecting her: Duncan is busy trying to look out for (and impress) Cora, Hawkeye's mind is also on Cora, and Ching's just sort of in the background.
So why NOT fall into Uncas' arms under the waterfall? Why NOT jump off a cliff after watching the one man who has protected you get brutally killed?  Duncan clearly can't help Alice at this point (since he's in the Huron BBQ pit), and when Uncas is killed Hawkeye and Ching haven't even made it to the cliffs yet. Alice is confronted with the death of her protector and the fact that maybe she's left all alone with Magua, who uses his bloody hand to call her back from the cliff's edge.
The way I see it: Maybe Alice's jump isn't so much a "lover's leap" for Uncas' sake as it is her one, final act of defiance. It's the one thing she can do to save herself from the fate that is apparently in store for her (becoming Magua's wife so Munro's "seed" isn't wiped out, as the Sachem says). But maybe I'm swayed on this point by something not related to LOTM at all. Ever read "Ivanhoe"? The Jewish maiden Rebecca threatens to throw herself from a tower when faced with the possibility of being raped by her captor, Brian de Bois-Guilbert. I think Alice is perhaps in a very similar situation at the end of LOTM. But that's just my humble opinion.
And I guess if Alice ISN'T in love with Uncas, it's good news for all Uncas fans. |
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Light of the Moon
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USA
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Posted - November 02 2006 : 12:03:44 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Lady of Glencairn
[quote
I take it you havent read a Cassie Edwards novel?? In her books women fall for the 'savages' like flies. But oh well ... that certainly isnt historically correct either ...
And for Light ... your lsat post was HILARIOUS!!
Oh you're too kind! Thanks LG.
Please take no offense in this but........
OH MY GOD! I cannot believe you mentioned Cassie Edwards! I was lent a book from a friend that knows my NA lust habits, I read it and put it down after chapter 5. There is soooooooo much in her books that is no where near reality!
Yep - I just about barfed over the whole thing.
Although imagining yourself in place of all those cheesy romance girls with the strong NA man all over you ...well, it does make up for something. But I still wouldn't read another one. Why read it when you can go after the real deal?
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Lady of Glencairn
Colonial Settler
South Africa
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Posted - November 02 2006 : 05:43:36 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Light of the Moon
quote:
Originally posted by Lady of Glencairn
[quote
I take it you havent read a Cassie Edwards novel?? In her books women fall for the 'savages' like flies. But oh well ... that certainly isnt historically correct either ...
And for Light ... your lsat post was HILARIOUS!!
Oh you're too kind! Thanks LG.
Please take no offense in this but........
OH MY GOD! I cannot believe you mentioned Cassie Edwards! I was lent a book from a friend that knows my NA lust habits, I read it and put it down after chapter 5. There is soooooooo much in her books that is no where near reality!
Yep - I just about barfed over the whole thing.
Although imagining yourself in place of all those cheesy romance girls with the strong NA man all over you...well, it does make up for something. But I still wouldn't read another one. Why read it when you can go after the real deal?
Oh no, perhaps you misunderstood my comment. I too barfed after reading the first chapter. Those simpering chits are too much, even for my very tolerant nature!! I found her books (yes I actually read another one in the hopes that it wouldnt be as cheesy and horrific as the previous one - my mistake) terribly melodramatic. Urgh!! Never again!! |
Lady of Glencairn
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Light of the Moon
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Posted - November 02 2006 : 11:04:12 AM
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Oh no. I didn't misunderstand at all. Actually I was agreeing with you. That's why I didn't want you to take any offense. Wasn't an attack but I guess it kinda' sounded like one. Sorry
'd the "girls dropping like flies" comment. It's rather pathetic.
That's ok. When mine gets out there I'll send you a copy. Hopes you like!
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angicx
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Posted - August 22 2007 : 1:29:56 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Irishgirl
I disagree WW and Meg(shocked to hear you say this). I never understood why Uncas was so ready to sacrifice his own life for a girl he had barely even spoken to. This scene would have explained why he did the foolish death run up the cliffside at he end to try and save Alice. I only understood this when I heard about the deleted scene where they had shown a connection between Uncas/Alice. That made it all clear to me.
I realize this is an old thread, but I came upon it looking for posts about Alice's braid, enjoyed all the different theories, and wanted to comment
I recognized what was going on between the two of them the first time I saw the movie... (at the risk of sounding smug  )
While love at first sight is thought by some to be a myth, I believe that's exactly what happened for Uncas pretty much right away. After the present danger sourrounding their meeting had died down and he had a moment to really "notice" Alice, I think he felt something right away (the river walk). Who's to say exactly why. I can tell you from first hand experience that it happens, as my ex-husband and myself met one night, and were together every day thereafter until our split 8 years later. I think it took Alice a bit longer to develop feelings for Uncas, but after the waterfall scene, I think they were there. I also like the story without the sex scene. I think the innocent quality of their feelings for each other is a big attraction for alot of fans, and certainly for me at the very least.  Their subtle attraction for each other was one of my fav parts of the movie. |
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angicx
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Posted - August 22 2007 : 2:01:46 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Lotte
However, the romantic side in me would see it that Alice did love Uncas, why else would she jump off the cliff after him if not because she couldn’t bear to live her life without him. It's also the eighteenth century so when Uncas stares at Alice and holds her under the waterfalls that would be considered quite improper, Alice is not so stupid as to not realise that Uncas has feelings for her.
Bingo. Young and frightened, she had no reason to jump if she wasn't distraught over Uncas. You can see it when it's clear he's loosing the battle with Magua and she pulls away from her captors and starts to cry, even before he goes over the cliff. She would have no reason to think that there wasn't a chance that the others still might be able to save her. I think she would have held out for that if she hadn't been agonizing over the loss of her short but intensely developed love for Uncas.
As far as I'm concerned, it's as clear as day. (the 'ole actions speak louder than words defense in this case) |
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Uncas and Alice: A Contrary Opinion
