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zinvor
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 Posted - May 16 2006 : 02:36:38 AM
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Poll Question:
Yesterday i was watching The film once more and a question crossed my mind (may be someone else's too) - What in fact was Magua going to do with Alice?
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Irishgirl
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Posted - May 17 2006 : 10:57:39 AM
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| Well I voted for the last one that he was angry and disappointed and had not had time to even think what to do with Alice. I believe he could have done any of the above things to Alice given time but she robbed him of the chance. I like to think that he would have kept her for his own wife and had children with her and who knows maybe in time he may even have come to truly care for her or perhaps love her and maybe by some miracle, Alice too, may have gotten over her fear or hatred of him and come to care for him especially if he treated her well. Then again, maybe pigs might fly some day too. |
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MeggieD
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Posted - May 17 2006 : 11:21:10 AM
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| I'm voting for the pigs for flying first....of course we aren't 100% sure that she was in love with Uncas (although how could she not be, handsome, brave, risked his life for her...I'd love him), I still don't think she would ever have come to care for Magua...Especially if she found out he'd killed her father. |
Uncas: "some food" |
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zinvor
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Posted - May 17 2006 : 1:43:29 PM
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I agree with Irishgirl and my answer was the same - that he didn't think about it yet. And the picture of magua and Alice happily "married" in some way attractive, perhaps it could be a story for another movie, unless the same movie already exists. Has anyone heard of a story like that? He (Indian) killed her (white woman's) family and took her as a slave/ wife, but as time goes by he starts seeing something more in her and she starts thinking may be he's not so horrible she'd imagined before... might be interesting.
But Magua would probably give her away to some other man... And Alice would be a bad wife for a warrior, wouldn't she? |
Man is indeed like monkey - the higher he gets the more he demonstrates his a** |
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Irishgirl
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Posted - May 17 2006 : 1:55:59 PM
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| Zinvor have you seen Follow the River. It is based on a true story apparently. In the movie Eric's character "Wildcat" attacks some settlers and kills some of them and takes a white woman and her son captive. She is also pregnant with another baby. Anyways, to cut a long story short he takes a liking to her and helps her out and is kind to her, even wanting her for his wife and saying he will raise her son as his own. It is a good movie especially if you like Eric as "eye candy". I won't tell you the rest in case you have not seen it and may want to but it is definitely worth checking out. Just reminded me of the Magua/Alice situation although "Wildcat" did not kill her husband as he was not there when the raid took place but he and his warriors did kill friends and maybe other relatives. Also the woman "Mary" in the story does form a bond with "Wildcat" and grows to like him. She is attracted to him in the movie and they do have chemistry together. |
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zinvor
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Posted - May 17 2006 : 2:03:16 PM
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| Unfortunately I haven't seen yet, but I've read about it, while I was looking Eric's filmography and I really want to see it. I like Unkas, though I am not a real fan. But I can't find this movie anywhere!! will try harder!! Thanks a lot. |
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Keira
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Posted - May 17 2006 : 2:38:35 PM
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| I think he was too angry to think at the moment..Maybe he was going to kill her or maybe he was going to keep her as his wife..After all he seemed like he almost felt something for Alice before she decided take her own life. |
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raindrops
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Posted - May 17 2006 : 2:55:49 PM
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I also voted for the last option. I think he wasn't sure at that point what he would do with Alice.
Taking her as his wife rises some questions, though. After all, he wanted to wipe out Munro's seeds and having children with Alice would be the opposite. Wouldn't it be better for him to find a wife among his own people? Probably as a brave and respected warrior he wouldn't have a problem with getting another Indian wife?
Just before Alice jumped he looked at her with some "human" emotions showing on his face but I'm not sure what exactly he felt. From what Wes Studi said in his interview I gather that it was a bit like father and child sort of feeling. |
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raindrops
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Posted - May 17 2006 : 3:15:14 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by zinvor
Has anyone heard of a story like that? He (Indian) killed her (white woman's) family and took her as a slave/ wife, but as time goes by he starts seeing something more in her and she starts thinking may be he's not so horrible she'd imagined before... might be interesting.
I've watched a film called "Stolen Women, Captured Hearts". Has anyone else seen it? Two white women are captured by Indians, who killed their companions  (I'm not sure if they were family members because I didn't see the beginning). The women live in Indian village for some time and one of them, Janine, falls for an Indian called Tokalah. He feels the same, actually he has seen her in a vision before she appeared in his life.  The problem is, she already has a white husband.[<:)] Also, the other woman hates her life with Indians. Then a lot of things happens but I will not say in case someone wants to watch it (if so please tell me what happened in the beginning!). It's a powerful love story.
Tokalah is played by Michael Greyeyes - another good-looking Indian (for me anyway). |
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Irishgirl
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Posted - May 17 2006 : 3:29:12 PM
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| Thanks raindrops. I will have to check that one out as it sounds like it is right up my alley. I love movies where white women are taken captive by Indians, especially if they are tall, dark and handsome. It may have been on tv over here at some stage as the title definitely sounds familiar to me. |
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Kaylynn44
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Posted - May 17 2006 : 3:58:22 PM
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"Stolen Women, Captured Hearts" is a very good movie. I always enjoy watching it whenever it comes on. Can't blame Anna for ditching her husband for Tokalah.
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raindrops
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Posted - May 17 2006 : 4:55:33 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Kaylynn44
Can't blame Anna for ditching her husband for Tokalah.
That a very good point Kaylynn, I couldn't agree more
And thanks for correcting my mix up with names (Janine is the actress's real name and she plays Anna) - sorry. I think I just got overexcited telling this story. 
I'd love to watch this film again but it's as difficult to find as some Eric's movies. |
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Irishgirl
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Posted - May 17 2006 : 10:42:15 PM
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| I looked up the movie and have seen it before a few years ago. I would love to see it again though and that movie cover looks pretty darn hot to me. I guess I will have to buy that one as well. Thankfully these movies are pretty easy to find over here on ebay. |
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Keira
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Posted - May 18 2006 : 06:27:19 AM
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| I`ve never heard about that movie "Stolen women, Captured hearts" before. The cover looks good and the plot sounds interesting. I`d definitely like to see it! |
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Irishgirl
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Posted - May 18 2006 : 10:56:08 PM
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| I just got through watching "True Women" It also had Michael Greyeyes in it playing a character named "Tarantula". Looking pretty hot I might add. This was a two part mini-series a few years ago and I recalled seeing it before and decided to watch it again. Best part is I picked it up at the local library for free. Great story of the strength of women, 3 women in particular. Anjelina Jolie, Dana Delaney and Annabeth Gish. I wish there had been more Indian parts in the movie than there was but those that were in it were pretty darn good. That Tarantula sure was a hot Indian. He had a very unique style with the stovepipe hat he wore and his face paint. Anyone seen this one? |
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zinvor
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Posted - May 20 2006 : 10:41:21 AM
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I believe I've seen "Stolen Women..." a few years ago but I've missed the beginning, too. Anyway I liked it very much and would love to see it again, especially after overlooking the hot cover..
As for women stolen by indians i recall one movie but i don't remember the name. It's an old one, and Indians are definitely "bad" ones in it. Some white men want to ransome white women from comanches, but most of them don't want to go for they are terrified and totally enslaved. One Mexican girl (the chief's wife) agrees to go. But having returned she finds herself surronded by contempt and loathing for she'd slept with Indian and even had two children. Although it's one-sided movie I liked it. Can anyone tell me what the name is? |
Man is indeed like monkey - the higher he gets the more he demonstrates his a** |
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alikws
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Posted - May 24 2006 : 4:39:23 PM
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tokala = lakota for 'small fox'
as for alice, most likely, she'd be traded to the french, second possibility is she being adopted as a daughter,
age and culture difference makes alice as a wife unlikely for a year or so at least...
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raindrops
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Posted - May 24 2006 : 6:11:15 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by alikws
tokala = lakota for 'small fox'
as for alice, most likely, she'd be traded to the french, second possibility is she being adopted as a daughter,
age and culture difference makes alice as a wife unlikely for a year or so at least...
Thank you for this interesting information. Sounds like you are familiar with the Indian culture and way of life? |
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alikws
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Posted - May 25 2006 : 10:40:43 AM
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abenaki, in the movie look for french allied natives with an ear to ear everything forward shaved, and ornate facial tatoos, in real life, more variance in hair, lots of double curve artwork
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Irishgirl
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Posted - May 25 2006 : 11:05:30 PM
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[quote][i]Originally posted by raindrops
I've watched a film called "Stolen Women, Captured Hearts". Has anyone else seen it? Two white women are captured by Indians, who killed their companions (I'm not sure if they were family members because I didn't see the beginning). The women live in Indian village for some time and one of them, Janine, falls for an Indian called Tokalah. He feels the same, actually he has seen her in a vision before she appeared in his life. The problem is, she already has a white husband.[<:)] Also, the other woman hates her life with Indians. Then a lot of things happens but I will not say in case someone wants to watch it (if so please tell me what happened in the beginning!). It's a powerful love story.
Tokalah is played by Michael Greyeyes - another good-looking Indian (for me anyway).
I just got through watching this one and it was really good. Boy that Michael Greyeyes sure is something else No one could have played Tokolah like he did, well probably Eric would have done a great job too but this part was Michael's. I highly recommend it to anyone. Glad she did the right thing at the end 
As for the beginning, well Tokolah and his warriors raid a wagon train and kill most of them. He comes upon the wagon with Anna and another pregnant woman in it and has his rifle pointed at them ready to kill them but when he recognizes the woman of his vision, whom he can't stop staring at, he lets them go.  Sarah is visiting with Anna at her house when Tokalah comes to get Anna. They are the only ones at home so nobody is killed. They are just taken.
I will definitely be watching this one many more times just to see Michael or should I say Tokalah. |
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raindrops
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Posted - May 26 2006 : 5:09:36 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Irishgirl
I just got through watching this one and it was really good. Boy that Michael Greyeyes sure is something else No one could have played Tokolah like he did, well probably Eric would have done a great job too but this part was Michael's. I highly recommend it to anyone. Glad she did the right thing at the end
You said it, girl!! Oh, Tokalah..!!
I wouldn't hesitate neither if I was in Anna's position.
quote:
As for the beginning, well Tokolah and his warriors raid a wagon train and kill most of them. He comes upon the wagon with Anna and another pregnant woman in it and has his rifle pointed at them ready to kill them but when he recognizes the woman of his vision, whom he can't stop staring at, he lets them go. Sarah is visiting with Anna at her house when Tokalah comes to get Anna. They are the only ones at home so nobody is killed. They are just taken.
I will definitely be watching this one many more times just to see Michael or should I say Tokalah.
Thank you very much for letting me know about what happened in the beginning. So he did not kill any member of her family. However, raiding a wagon and killing people including women is quite a bad thing to do.. I wonder why the Indians did it. Maybe for a more dramatic effect..
How about the vision, is it shown before Tokalah comes across Anna or it it shown as his recollection just when he sees her?
You are so lucky you have easy access to all these films, I'm having difficulties getting hold of them here in London. Seems, I'll end up having to ship them from the US.. |
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Irishgirl
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Posted - May 26 2006 : 6:43:39 PM
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[quote][i]Originally posted by raindrops[/
Thank you very much for letting me know about what happened in the beginning. So he did not kill any member of her family. However, raiding a wagon and killing people including women is quite a bad thing to do.. I wonder why the Indians did it. Maybe for a more dramatic effect..
How about the vision, is it shown before Tokalah comes across Anna or it it shown as his recollection just when he sees her?
You are so lucky you have easy access to all these films, I'm having difficulties getting hold of them here in London. Seems, I'll end up having to ship them from the US..
He does not kill any of her family, her brother who is the Preacher or her husband as no one else is there when she and Sarah are taken from the house.
General Custer has just slaughtered an entire Indian Village on the Washita and the Indians were, naturally enough, out for revenge. You cannot blame them for attacking the wagon train and killing "whites"
We never get to see Tokolah's vision, just hear about it from him when he eventually tells Anna just before she leaves him.
I truly loved this movie and Tokolah  is one hot Indian in this one. No wonder she does what she does at the end. I would do the exact same thing. I think he and Anna had some great on screen chemistry too.
 So sad for you raindrops that you have trouble finding these movies over there in London. We are so lucky to have them over here. The copy of Stolen Women Captured Hearts that I got off ebay is Region Free so it would play over there I believe. Check it out as you need this one in your DVD collection and thanks for recommending it in the first place.
By the way, have you paid a visit to Michael's website I have and signed his guestbook. Just no message board on there unfortunately. Great pics of him too.
 Bye |
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raindrops
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Posted - May 27 2006 : 8:54:54 PM
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Thank you, Irishgirl, for the additional information. Now the whole story is clear to me. Indeed, one can't blame the Indians for attacking the wagon. As for the vision it makes sense that it wasn't shown in the beginning. I guess the viewers wonder why Tokalah () let Anna and her friend go and they find explanation later in the film, which makes it all more interesting. Thanks again.
I'm really glad you had a good time watching this film. |
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Dark Woods
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Posted - May 31 2006 : 7:36:46 PM
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The question was what Magua was going to do with Alice.
I believe his intention was to obey the Sachem and make her his wife.
As a practical matter, for that to happen, Alice would have to somehow deal with her tragedies, and transform herself to be an effective part of Magua's group. I believe he wanted to move quite a ways out into the wilderness. It would be quite a while before she would be in any sort of settled situation.
If Alice could somehow change and keep up with Magua, she would be okay. Unfortunately, I think she would be a serious drag on Magua's fast moving group. At some point Magua would have enough of her delay, and kill her for ther greater good of his group, despite the Sachem's command. |
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zinvor
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Posted - June 03 2006 : 09:56:27 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Dark Woods
I think she would be a serious drag on Magua's fast moving group. At some point Magua would have enough of her delay, and kill her for ther greater good of his group, despite the Sachem's command.
I agree. Especially taking into consideration Father Jean de Brebeuf's recommendations (you may see them in History section):
You must never keep the Indians waiting at the time of embarking.
Eat as soon as day breaks, for Indians when on the road, eat only at the rising and the setting of the sun.
Be the least troublesome to the Indians.
Bear with their imperfections, and you must try always to appear cheerful.
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nekutmeqwanoc
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Posted - June 10 2006 : 6:38:49 PM
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| i chose the last one.but i thibnk he would either have traded her so he could become a trader as the whites or killed or treated her as bad as possible |
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Magua and Alice
