|
|
Author |
Topic |
Kurt
Mohicanite
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: September 27 2003
Status: offline
|
Posted - December 30 2003 : 9:27:44 PM
|
We just got back from seeing the movie and I was surprized how close Jackson was able to get. If he was allowed to present 40-50 hours of film, I'm sure he could have come closer to the book. Jackson definitely respects the Professor's work. The movie was condensed and simplified but had good spirit. |
Yr. obt. svt. Kurt |
report to moderator |
|
Kurt
Mohicanite
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: September 27 2003
Status: offline
|
Posted - December 31 2003 : 07:32:16 AM
|
I am trying to decide how to photograph thinking but without much luck... |
Yr. obt. svt. Kurt |
report to moderator |
|
Ilse
The Dutch Trader
Netherlands
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: May 17 2002
Status: offline
Donating Member |
Posted - December 31 2003 : 11:16:28 AM
|
I felt the movie was rushed in places and too slow in other places. Also, I'm not happy with what was left out and what remained in. I think some of the battle stuff could have been cut to make room for some crucial scenes. Probably the extended edition will solve some of those issues for me. Then there were some subjects I thought Jackson didn't handle very well.
Overall, I did enjoy the movie a lot, it is visually breathtaking, but I didn't get that sense of involvement and excitement I had with the first two. Maybe my expectations were just too high
|
OH HAI! Blessinz of teh Ceiling Cat be apwn yu, srsly. http://www.lolcatbible.com/index.php?title=Main_Page |
report to moderator |
|
Lainey
TGAT
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: May 18 2002
Status: offline
Administrator |
Posted - December 31 2003 : 12:28:26 PM
|
I heard a nearly identical review from someone else; pretty much called it as you did, Ilse. She enjoyed it very much, though, despite the flaws. (And she's an avid Tolkien fan.)
Can't wait to see the extended edition. |
"Fides et Ratio" |
report to moderator |
|
Jo
Sweetser 4 Rep
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: May 27 2002
Status: offline
|
Posted - December 31 2003 : 2:25:35 PM
|
As Doc M stated, I also read that DDL originally was to be Aragon; but declined due to the long shoot - probably couldn't get away from his cobbler duties; not enough vacation accrued. Watching the three of them: Aragon, Legolas and Gimminliiiissii; (always poor on spelling here) run over hill and dale, I am always reminded of LOTM. In fact, the family, well trained by now, also noted this fact. Now, the burning question, did Jackson have them use Addidas or Reebok? I haven't see the latest installment yet; although my boys have, with mixed reviews. I never read the books in my youth; not being into hobbits or talking trees at all, but I must admit I was very entertained by the first two movies and look forward to the latest one. At least Mr. Townsend isn't Aragon; although I would rather have watched DDL; Viggo is pretty easy on the eye.
Jo |
report to moderator |
|
Ilse
The Dutch Trader
Netherlands
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: May 17 2002
Status: offline
Donating Member |
Posted - January 01 2004 : 2:52:45 PM
|
It's just too bad I can't see the extended edition on the big screen though....
Oh, funny, I saw Ralph Bakshi's animated version from 1978 on TV today. I had totally forgotten about that one. Lots of vikings in there |
OH HAI! Blessinz of teh Ceiling Cat be apwn yu, srsly. http://www.lolcatbible.com/index.php?title=Main_Page |
report to moderator |
|
asegal
Pathfinder
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: June 06 2002
Status: offline
|
Posted - January 07 2004 : 6:49:13 PM
|
Hilarious and scholarly Web parody...
Hi all. I just wanted to point you to
http://www.mark-shea.com/LOTR.html
This is a parody of the documentary hypothesis (The claim that the Torah/Pentateuch was composed over centuries by different authors as opposed to given by God to Moses)using LOTR,
and the redactors "T" (Tolkien) and "PJ" Peter Jackson.
Whether you hold by the DH or not, if you are a Tolkien fan, you'll enjoy it!
ROTK is magnificent, by the way... just two quibbles
1) Not as much of the original dialogue as the 1979 Rankin-Bass cartoon (which has a fond place in my heart, as it introduced me to LOTR, though I already had seen the Hobbit cartoon)[A geeky objection, I know)
2) Too drawn out and slow an ending (though frankly, I didn't mind much; my brother and I visited the restroom midway and had no problems on that front)
Overall, magnificent, and I think it will get Best Picture!
Best, Ariel
|
report to moderator |
|
Lainey
TGAT
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: May 18 2002
Status: offline
Administrator |
Posted - January 08 2004 : 12:10:18 PM
|
Hi, Ariel,
I am SO glad you posted this! I came across it recently & emailed it to Ilse - hilarious & scholarly, indeed!
A must read parody!!!!! |
"Fides et Ratio" |
report to moderator |
|
Adele
The Huggy Merchant
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: May 17 2002
Status: offline
|
Posted - January 10 2004 : 7:39:48 PM
|
Well, I finally got to see ROTK tonight, on my second attempt! Am now suitably stuffed with an obscene amount of toffee popcorn, have several soggy kleenex in my pocket, and am glad to have seen the long awaited final part!
I ought to note, there may be a slight spoiler in here for someone who hasn't read the book or seen the movie - proceed with caution!!
I have a tendency to agree with Ilse with regard to some scenes not being quite what I expected, and some scenes absent. Am sincerely hoping that they WERE shot, and that they will find their way into the extended edition. The hint of Eowyn and Faramir standing together at the coronation makes me hope that there will be more of that particular story in the dvd, since Eowyn is one of my favourite characters. The beginning seemed awkward and disjointed but I felt that it just got better and better towards the end with the focus (rightly) being on the people and the relationships, rather than the overwhelming special effects of the battles.
If I was to highlight one performance, it would be Sean Astin's. I think he was just fantastic in a role that so easily could have been overly sentimental and shallow. And I think Peter Jackson did a great job with the ending, which after all the wait, could have been such an anti-climax (although, my choice would have been to end it with the look that Frodo gives the hobbits aimed directly at the camera - I thought that was really a wonderful shot.
All in all, I really enjoyed it, and I am looking forward to the extended edition which I am hoping will live up to the other two.
HM |
report to moderator |
|
SgtMunro
Soldier of the King
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: September 23 2002
Status: offline
Donating Member |
Posted - January 14 2004 : 10:41:56 AM
|
quote: The hint of Eowyn and Faramir standing together at the coronation makes me hope that there will be more of that particular story in the dvd, since Eowyn is one of my favourite characters.
Considering that the first two 'Extended Version' DVD's had almost 30% more footage a piece, which helped fill in some of the gaps, I am inclined to believe that you will find a similar amount of "hole plugging" in the third one.
Your Most Humble Servant,
|
Serjeant-Major Duncan Munro Capt. Thos. Graham's Coy. 42nd Royal Highland Regiment of Foote (The Black Sheep of the Black Watch)
"Nemo Me Impune Lacessit" -Or- "Recruit locally, fight globally." |
report to moderator |
|
Highlander
Colonial Militia
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: February 04 2003
Status: offline
|
Posted - January 14 2004 : 3:45:28 PM
|
quote: Originally posted by SgtMunro
quote: The hint of Eowyn and Faramir standing together at the coronation makes me hope that there will be more of that particular story in the dvd, since Eowyn is one of my favourite characters.
Considering that the first two 'Extended Version' DVD's had almost 30% more footage a piece, which helped fill in some of the gaps, I am inclined to believe that you will find a similar amount of "hole plugging" in the third one.
Your Most Humble Servant,
That would be good.The more footage,the better. |
Highlander |
report to moderator |
|
asegal
Pathfinder
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: June 06 2002
Status: offline
|
Posted - January 23 2004 : 12:25:45 AM
|
Hi all! Amazing discoveries!!!
First, a bit of extreme pedantry. When I said earlier that I had seen the Hobbit cartoon before I knew about LOTR, that was not really true. My mom got me the storybook to the cartoon and the record (yes vinyl) when I was in nursery school. I remember a babysitter bringing over something called LOTR. Then, I was channel surfing in the mid 80s, and saw a cartoon on TV that looked like the Hobbit...but how old is Bilbo?! What happened to Gollum!?
Intrigued, I got my mom's old psychedelic Christmas Tree Emu covered Hobbit and LOTR and read them in Spring 1987, age 10 1/2. Then I rewatched the cartoons and the Bakshi rotoscoped version over the next 5 yrs. </pedantry> ---------- 1) I was at a Teaching Assistant prep seminar today, and there was a girl from Kirghizstan named (I kid you not) NAZGUL !! She said it means "flower" and she gets a lot of jokes from friends [I told it I had my share of yuks when the Little Mermaid was named Ariel] ---------- 2) There is a Tolkien expert at my school, University of MD. She strongly dislikes the movies, except for Boromir's performance, which she says is still not excellent. Still, she loves the books, so I'll give her the benefit of the doubt... ------------ 3) Saving the absolute best for last: In the book _The Road to Middle -Earth_, by Tolkien scholar T.A. Shippey (Boston: Houghton Mifflin, 1983), p. 223) notes [I abbreviate and paraphrase at times]:
"anyone who reads the 'Introduction' to [an English folk song book; info available upon request]...will be struck by the strange resemblance of the mountain country of North Carolina before WWI to the Shire...Mr Guy Davenport in the New York Times (23 Feb 1979) records JRRT grilling an American classmate of his for 'tales of Kentucky folk...family names like Barefoott and Boffin and Baggins and good country names like that'. Old country names, one might add: in Kentucky etc., JRRT obviously thought, there had for a time been a place where English people and English traditions could flourish by themselves free of the chronic imperialism of Latin, Celtic, and French. [Here comes the really juicy stuff]
In the same way Fenimore Cooper's hero Natty Bumppo prides himself on being 'a man whose blood is without a cross'; and Tolkien recorded an early devotion to Red Indians, bows and arrows and forests [The quote, from "On Fairy-stories" in _Tree and Leaf_, pp.39-40: "I had no desire to have either dreams or adventures like _Alice [in Wonderland], and the account of them merely amused me. I had very little desire to look for buried treasure or fight pirates, and _Treasure Island_ left me cool. Red Indians were better: there were bows and arrows (I had and have a wholly unsatisfied desire to shoot well with a bow), and strange languages, and glimpses of an archaic mode of life, and, above all, forests in such stories. But the land of Merlin and Arthur was better than these, and best of all the nameless North of Sigurd of the Volsungs, and the prince of all dragons."] Shippey continues: The journey of the Fellowship from Lorien to Tol Brandir, w/ its canoes and portages, often recalls LOTM
, and as the travelers move from forest to prairie, like the American pioneers, Aragorn and Eomer for a moment preserve faint traces of 'the Deerslayer' and the Sioux...The complaint in one of the sillier reviews of LOTR, that none of its characters (except Gimli :)) had 'an even faintly American temperament', is as imperceptive as irrelevant. Once upon a time all Americans were English [!? Shippey is generalizing here]; caelum non animam mutant qui trans mare currunt." [Elaine, what does Shippey mean??]
WHEW....there you have it!! Now back to Masters' thesis, teaching, class...I won't be posting for a while....but I will see ROTK on a big screen Saturday night!!!
Be well all. Ariel
P.S. Shippey is |
report to moderator |
|
Lainey
TGAT
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: May 18 2002
Status: offline
Administrator |
Posted - January 24 2004 : 12:34:21 AM
|
quote: Hi all! Amazing discoveries!!!
First, a bit of extreme pedantry. When I said earlier that I had seen the Hobbit cartoon before I knew about LOTR, that was not really true. My mom got me the storybook to the cartoon and the record (yes vinyl) when I was in nursery school. I remember a babysitter bringing over something called LOTR. Then, I was channel surfing in the mid 80s, and saw a cartoon on TV that looked like the Hobbit...but how old is Bilbo?! What happened to Gollum!?
Intrigued, I got my mom's old psychedelic Christmas Tree Emu covered Hobbit and LOTR and read them in Spring 1987, age 10 1/2. Then I rewatched the cartoons and the Bakshi rotoscoped version over the next 5 yrs. </pedantry> ---------- 1) I was at a Teaching Assistant prep seminar today, and there was a girl from Kirghizstan named (I kid you not) NAZGUL !! She said it means "flower" and she gets a lot of jokes from friends [I told it I had my share of yuks when the Little Mermaid was named Ariel] ---------- 2) There is a Tolkien expert at my school, University of MD. She strongly dislikes the movies, except for Boromir's performance, which she says is still not excellent. Still, she loves the books, so I'll give her the benefit of the doubt... ------------ 3) Saving the absolute best for last: In the book _The Road to Middle -Earth_, by Tolkien scholar T.A. Shippey (Boston: Houghton Mifflin, 1983), p. 223) notes [I abbreviate and paraphrase at times]:
"anyone who reads the 'Introduction' to [an English folk song book; info available upon request]...will be struck by the strange resemblance of the mountain country of North Carolina before WWI to the Shire...Mr Guy Davenport in the New York Times (23 Feb 1979) records JRRT grilling an American classmate of his for 'tales of Kentucky folk...family names like Barefoott and Boffin and Baggins and good country names like that'. Old country names, one might add: in Kentucky etc., JRRT obviously thought, there had for a time been a place where English people and English traditions could flourish by themselves free of the chronic imperialism of Latin, Celtic, and French. [Here comes the really juicy stuff]
In the same way Fenimore Cooper's hero Natty Bumppo prides himself on being 'a man whose blood is without a cross'; and Tolkien recorded an early devotion to Red Indians, bows and arrows and forests [The quote, from "On Fairy-stories" in _Tree and Leaf_, pp.39-40: "I had no desire to have either dreams or adventures like _Alice [in Wonderland], and the account of them merely amused me. I had very little desire to look for buried treasure or fight pirates, and _Treasure Island_ left me cool. Red Indians were better: there were bows and arrows (I had and have a wholly unsatisfied desire to shoot well with a bow), and strange languages, and glimpses of an archaic mode of life, and, above all, forests in such stories. But the land of Merlin and Arthur was better than these, and best of all the nameless North of Sigurd of the Volsungs, and the prince of all dragons."] Shippey continues: The journey of the Fellowship from Lorien to Tol Brandir, w/ its canoes and portages, often recalls LOTM
, and as the travelers move from forest to prairie, like the American pioneers, Aragorn and Eomer for a moment preserve faint traces of 'the Deerslayer' and the Sioux...The complaint in one of the sillier reviews of LOTR, that none of its characters (except Gimli :)) had 'an even faintly American temperament', is as imperceptive as irrelevant. Once upon a time all Americans were English [!? Shippey is generalizing here]; caelum non animam mutant qui trans mare currunt." [Elaine, what does Shippey mean??]
WHEW....there you have it!! Now back to Masters' thesis, teaching, class...I won't be posting for a whil |
report to moderator |
|
asegal
Pathfinder
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: June 06 2002
Status: offline
|
Posted - January 26 2004 : 10:35:37 PM
|
More on University of MD Professor Verlyn Flieger.
First, the bad news...
http://www.inform.umd.edu/News/Diamondback/archives/2003/12/15/news13.html
Tolkien expert doesn't like Rings trilogy
"Lousy. Poorly written. Poorly acted."
Maryland's Tolkien expert - English professor Verlyn Flieger - says that about her view of Director Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings trilogy. The third and final installment of the Middle Earth saga will be released in theaters Dec. 17. And while fans around the world have embraced Jackson's vision of Tolkien's universe, Flieger has taken a decidedly contrary view of the films.
"I think the (Lord of the Rings) films are lousy, poorly written and in many instances poorly acted. There's also too much emphasis on special effects. That subverts one of the book's great strengths, which is the power to awaken the reader's imagination. These films, in fact, leave nothing to the imagination," Flieger said in a statement. ----------------------
The OneRing.net had an interview w/ Dr. Flieger at
http://greenbooks.theonering.net/guest/files/100102.html
Here is the relevant part:
Q. Last, any comments on Peter Jackson's film of The Fellowship of The Ring?
A. I didn't like it. But then, it wasn't aimed at me. It was aimed at the generations who've grown up on Star Wars and hunger for more and more action and greater and greater special effects. Jackson has turned an extremely sophisticated, complex and subtle -- and very long -- story into an action movie that I think satisfies the audience for whom he made it. The time constraint that film format enforces makes it almost certain that, even making three separate films Jackson cannot get the fullness of Tolkien's story into a movie. Three hours of sitting is about the outside limit. After that your bum gets numb.I felt some parts were disastrously miscast, Elrond for example. Not the actor's fault, though if I'd been him I wouldn't have stood for that hairdo. Elijah Wood is just wrong for Frodo -- too young, too pretty, too goggle-eyed. And the script gave the character no chance to develop. His moments of growth in the barrow was omitted; his bravery when he turns and faces the Black Riders at the Ford was left out in favor of Arwen as Our Lady of the Ford. Galadriel was terrible, and since Cate Blanchett is a fine actor, she must have been directed to perform in that wooden, zombie-like manner. Sean Bean is the only person who played as if he believed who he was. His Boromir was a real person, not a type. I found him totally convincing, and his funeral journey down the river and over the falls was the film's finest moment. Truly moving. Although the script sentimentalized and overdid the character's repentance at the end. Boromir is not that good. As for un-Tolkienian lines like Gimli's "Nobody tosses a dwarf," and Strider's "Let's hunt some orc," they are beyond comment. ------------------------------
It goes without saying that I don't hold that way!!!! I suppose that no film version could possibly have satisfied her
------------------- Still, her works are deserving of praise and go deep into JRRT's ideas and motifs, I've heard.
Here is her professional info:
http://www.english.umd.edu/faculty/faculty-e-h.html
Verlyn Flieger
Rank: Professor E-mail: vf6@umail.umd.edu Telephone: (301) 405-3836
Degree: Ph.D. Catholic University of America, 1977 Books: A Question of Time: J. R. R. Tolkien's Road to Faerie (1997); Splintered Light: Logos and Language in Tolkien's World (Eerdmans, 1983); Articles: 20 articles published in such collections and journals as Saga: Best New Writings on Mythology, Women and Utopia: Critical Interpretations, Tolkien: New Critical Perspectives, and Studies in the Literary Imagination; Fellowships/Prizes: NEH Grant, National Institute for Secondary Teachers on Greek Mythology, 1989. Teaching/Service: Lilly-CTE Award for Departmental Exc |
report to moderator |
|
SgtMunro
Soldier of the King
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]: September 23 2002
Status: offline
Donating Member |
Posted - January 26 2004 : 11:13:45 PM
|
I agree with your assesment Ariel, that being no screenplay would have satisfied her. Perhaps Dr. Flieger should log some time in the real world working for a living. This way she would appreciate a movie like LOTR for what it is, a way for folks to get a three hour break from work, household obligations, making the bills, 'terror alerts', etc.
Your Most Humble Servant, |
Serjeant-Major Duncan Munro Capt. Thos. Graham's Coy. 42nd Royal Highland Regiment of Foote (The Black Sheep of the Black Watch)
"Nemo Me Impune Lacessit" -Or- "Recruit locally, fight globally." |
report to moderator |
|
Topic |
|
|
|
The Mohican Board! [Bumppo's Redux!] |
© 1997-2025 - Mohican Press |
|
|
Current Mohicanland page raised in 0.31 seconds |
|
|