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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
 Posted - March 20 2005 : 4:09:04 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Anonymous Poster8169
You falsified an Indian perspective. I don't think most Indians would take kindly to that kind of abduction of their identity.
R. Larsen
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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - March 20 2005 : 4:17:53 PM
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| error, see below |
Edited by - joseph wiggs on March 20 2005 4:34:26 PM |
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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - March 20 2005 : 4:32:06 PM
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The specific line that I posted earlier and, appeared to have incensed Larsen is:
I GIVE YOU THESE BECAUSE THEY HAVE NO EARS." (page 2-Indian perspective)
I refused to cater to what I perceived as a "demand" and did not identify my source for this information. Larsen later referred to me as a "liar." Thought it was time to set the record straight.
Some may consider this info. as poignant, romanticism, B.S., or absolute crap; I don't necessarily disagree. However I did not create it.
CUSTER'S GHOST TO SITTING BULL
http://home.earthlink.net/~kgann/ghosttext.html |
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Anonymous Poster8169
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - March 20 2005 : 7:13:08 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by joseph wiggs
The specific line that I posted earlier and, appeared to have incensed Larsen is:
I GIVE YOU THESE BECAUSE THEY HAVE NO EARS." (page 2-Indian perspective)
Wrong. I asked where the whole thing was coming from. Repeatedly. As I recall, your excerpts from Sitting Bull's "dream" limped over a series of posts, and I think I asked for a reference after nearly each one. Which you never gave. I suppose it was some "lost knowledge" just your own?
quote:
I refused to cater to what I perceived as a "demand" and did not identify my source for this information. Larsen later referred to me as a "liar." Thought it was time to set the record straight.
It was time back in June of last year when you first began posting that trash.
quote:
Some may consider this info. as poignant, romanticism, B.S., or absolute crap; I don't necessarily disagree. However I did not create it.
If you didn't create it then it's a mystery to me why you didn't point out to others where you were getting it from. You obviously had a transcript at hand. This board is not the Psychic Friends Crap Club; when we quote stuff, presumably we have something at hand which we are quoting and that we can direct others too.
quote:
CUSTER'S GHOST TO SITTING BULL
http://home.earthlink.net/~kgann/ghosttext.html
Page Not Found
We're Sorry! We can't locate the page you requested.
R. Larsen |
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Anonymous Poster8169
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - March 20 2005 : 8:29:22 PM
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Never mind; I was able to access the page through Google. The "Ghost Text" printed on that site is not the same one you put up on this board. The guy who owns it, however, says he "adapted" it from a passage in a book by Martin Schulmann called "Karmic Astrology," and the version in Schulmann (which I accessed through Amazon's Look Inside feature) matches yours exactly. The full title is "Karmic Astrology: The Moon's Nodes and Reincarnation". The Sitting Bull ghost text is on pages 11-12 of same.
Unlike you, Schulmann has no reticence revealing where he got it from. "As this page was being written, the entire room became filled with the spirit of Sitting Bull. For over an hour I was pulled into trance while he telegraphed to me these exact words spoken to him a century ago" (12).
It's obvious now why you refused to reveal your source. I'll retract what I said about you making it up. You deserve to be condemned, however, for posting this ****, and for trying to pass it off as something "From the Indian Side" when you knew it to come from nobody but some jackass trying to hawk a book to the gullible and dull.
R. Larsen
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Edited by - Anonymous Poster8169 on March 20 2005 8:38:06 PM |
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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - April 17 2005 : 8:22:30 PM
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I've been away for a while. I welcome this opportunity to respond to you last post. However, I am non-plussed over how easily you succumb to your propensity to react in long, vehement speeches of denunciation (a harangue as it were)when aroused?
I consider no one on the forum to be gullible and dull, even you. We all have something to offer, that's why I enjoy these discussions.
Once again, my friend, I refused to post my source because you are not the "Thread Police." I will post as I desire, when I desire and certainly not upon your command.
Lastly, I want you to know that I sincerely enjoy your comments. It is so unique to exchange ideas with someone who believes that I'm a total idiot sans reading comprehension skills. Who knows, perhaps one day I will write something that you could stomach. One can only hope. |
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Anonymous Poster8169
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - April 20 2005 : 5:38:40 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by joseph wiggs
Come off it, Wiggs. You shouldn't be passing off astrological readings as historical sources. You didn't ID your source because you knew no one would like your polluting the board with that nonsense.
R. Larsen |
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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - April 21 2005 : 7:11:16 PM
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| If it makes you feel comfortable to arrive at the above conclusion, I have no problem with it whatsoever. As you can not possibly know what motivates me (or any other human being for that matter;unless we told you)your statement is patently foolish and, does not serve you well. Further, they only subtract from any potential value inherent in your threads. |
Edited by - joseph wiggs on April 21 2005 7:14:22 PM |
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Anonymous Poster8169
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - April 22 2005 : 7:47:29 PM
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A good guess, and one I wouldn't have had to make if you hadn't gone about posting astrology readings without telling us so.
R. Larsen |
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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - April 22 2005 : 8:42:41 PM
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My dear Larsen, again, plainly and slowly so that even you may understand. Since you can not possible read my mind, do not continue on insisting that you have the ability to "know" or "guess" my actions. It was your knowing and guessing wrongly, in the first place, that brought us here.
On the other hand, if you do possess the psychic powers that you seem to claim, I have two requests:
A. What is the next winning Lottery number?;
B. What am I thinking about you right now? |
Edited by - joseph wiggs on April 22 2005 8:46:23 PM |
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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - April 22 2005 : 8:49:44 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Anonymous Poster8169
A good guess, and one I wouldn't have had to make if you hadn't gone about posting astrology readings without telling us so.
R. Larsen
Post Script: The only thing one has to do, in life, is breath and pay taxes. Everything else in life is choice. |
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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - June 07 2006 : 8:10:49 PM
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| Correction, unfortunately you have to die also. |
Edited by - joseph wiggs on June 07 2006 8:18:54 PM |
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BJMarkland
Colonel
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - June 08 2006 : 01:56:00 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by joseph wiggs
Correction, unfortunately you have to die also.
Joe, glad you finally realized that!
Be good and have a great summer!
Billy |
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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - June 08 2006 : 8:39:40 PM
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| You Sir are, and always have been, a gentleman. I have learned much from you, particularly when we disagree. Disagreement is such a wonderful learning tool especially when the rules of decorum are adhered to. I'll be good, and you have a great summer too! |
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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - December 10 2006 : 8:53:27 PM
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An important part of the ideology of "freedom of Speech" is the giving, acceptance, and/or complete disregard of opinions. Opinions may often breed an interchange of thought that often create innovative and novel ideas and thoughts that, generally, benefit mankind. Sometimes, unfortunately, opinions have as much merit and value as a drunken sailor on shore leave(my apologies to the U.S. Navy.)
Too many opinions are based upon an overwhelming personal need to be RIGHT, regardless of the preponderance of evidence to the contrary. After all,some of us abhor the idea of being found WRONG in the company of our peers. An understandable concept of course.
Having presented this preamble of explanation regarding opinions, I wish to take this time out to present an opinion of mine.
A consistent and unsubstantiated "truth" that I have heard so often(regarding this battle) runs along lines similar to this. "Custer was had such a thirst for glory that he refused to listen to his scouts who pleaded with him to not attack a village the size of Chicago. Thus, he needlessly sacrificed the lives of himself and his men."
The unvarnished truth is that several of his scouts insisted that he attack prematurely! The following excerpt is from the Arikara Narrative (edited by O.G. Libby).
"Then the scouts sat down and one of the Crow scouts, Big Belly, got up and and asked Custer through their Crow interpreter what he thought of of the Dakota camp he had seen. Custer said: "This camp(Indian) has not seen our army, none of their scouts have seen us."
Big Belly replied: "You say we have not been seen. These Sioux we have seen at the foot of the hill, two going one way, and four the other, are good scouts;they have seen the smoke of our camp."
Custer said, speaking angrily: "I say again we have not been seen. That camp has not seen us, I am going ahead to carry out what I think. I will wait until it is dark then we will march, we will place our Army around the Sioux camp."
Big Belly replied: "That plan is bad, it should not be carried out." Red Star as he sat listening first thought that Custer's plan was good. The Crow scouts insisted that the Dakota scouts had already seen the army and would report its coming and that they would attack Custer's Army's. They wanted him to attack at once, that day, and capture the horses of the Dakota and leave then unable to move rapidly."
Only after a lengthy and sometimes bitter debate with his scouts, did Custer reply: "Yes, it shall be done as you say." This statement plays havoc with the "few" who insist that Custer's ego was such that he ignored the sound and solid advice from his sage scouts so that he could achieve personal glory thereby sacrificing himself and his troops.
He listened to Big Belly, one of his scouts, and the rest is history. When ever we attempt to paint a dastardly portrait that implicates a historically character as being overwhelming obnoxious we often paint ourselves into a corner. there are exceptions of course. However, contrary to myth, Custer performed his actions based on evidence known to him at the time of the battle. Hindsight is twenty-twenty. |
Edited by - joseph wiggs on December 10 2006 9:07:30 PM |
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AZ Ranger
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 11 2006 : 06:41:10 AM
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Joe I believe your are correct about the advice received by the scouts. Within each persons ability to chose what to do there are internal filters. The choice of attack today or tomorrow were both within Custer's personality to do. Telling him not to attack at all I believe would be a different issue.
AZ Ranger |
“ An officer's first duty is to his horses.”
SEMPER FI |
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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - December 15 2006 : 7:43:19 PM
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Absolutely correct AZ. He would have regarded the advice to "not" attack the village with disdain and absolute disgust. His resolve to attack that village was permanently embedded in the very fiber of his being. I believe, rightly or wrongly, that he possessed an innate desire to punish these recalcitrant heathens for their insolent resolve in disregarding orders to report immediately to the nearest Reservation in the neighborhood. The reality that they did not want to do so (who would) was irrelevant and, simply not an issue.
Such an ideology does not make Custer a horrid bigot devoid of human compassion. It does make him a prime example of the typical Caucasian male of the nineteenth century. We, the people of today, find such an attitude towards any minority people as reprehensible. However, a hundred years ago such feelings were deemed sociably acceptable and correct.
I have never imagined the General to be anything more than what he was;an enthusiastic individual striving to be the best that he could be, even at the expense of others. |
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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - December 22 2006 : 8:55:02 PM
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To all the members of this board, I wish you a very Merry Christmas and the happiest New Year possible. God Bless each and everyone of you!   |
Edited by - joseph wiggs on December 22 2006 8:58:42 PM |
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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - January 27 2007 : 9:08:39 PM
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"Brothers, I have listened to a great many talks from our great father (President Jackson). but they always began and ended in this: 'Get a little further, you are too near me."
Speckled Snake,Creek. |
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joseph wiggs
Brigadier General
Status: offline |
Posted - June 16 2007 : 4:03:16 PM
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Across The Big Water:
"We liked Grandmother England because we could see that she was a fine woman, and she was good to us. maybe if she had been our Grandmother, it would have been better for our people."
Black Elk Speaks. |
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joe wiggs
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - May 21 2008 : 7:41:18 PM
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| There have been many discussions regarding the Indian Scouts who participated in this battle. I need not divulge the names of the Crow Scouts as they are known to all. Little has been said about the Arikara Scout (Rees) who played an integral part in this battle. A substantial portion of their number died in this battle after fighting with much bravery and determination. I sincerely believe that it is only proper and honorable to discuss their contributions to the enigma that is called, by some, Custer's Last Stand. What do you think? |
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joe wiggs
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - May 25 2008 : 6:00:03 PM
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In 1607, the Powhatan Confederacy did much to succor the ill-prepared English settlers at Jamestown. They brought the starving colonist food and introduced them to tobacco. While the food idea was certainly beneficial the second gift has gone far towards accomplishing the demise of the "Wasichus" than the Indian could ever hope for.
Be as it may, their kindness was re-payed with treachery. When they fought back they were deemed savages and treated accordingly. |
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joe wiggs
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - July 08 2008 : 7:41:51 PM
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"Why do you ask me to sign away my country...I have no other home than this....Take way your paper. I will not touch it with my hand."
-Chief Joseph of the Nez Perces, about 1855 |
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Walter Bliss
Recruit
Status: offline |
Posted - February 25 2013 : 02:20:47 AM
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| This post was started concerning Rain in the Face. I am looking for information about a dear family friend. We loved him so fondly and now I find we know so little about him. He was the son of Jim Many Rains and Lorette D. Maniojon of Arizona although they were both born in South Dakota. Jim Many Rains was understood to be a descendant of Rain in the Face. |
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joe wiggs
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - March 17 2013 : 7:08:24 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Walter Bliss
This post was started concerning Rain in the Face. I am looking for information about a dear family friend. We loved him so fondly and now I find we know so little about him. He was the son of Jim Many Rains and Lorette D. Maniojon of Arizona although they were both born in South Dakota. Jim Many Rains was understood to be a descendant of Rain in the Face.
Walter I sure wish I could help you but, so far, I have been able to come up with anything. I hope that someday soon someone, somewhere will be able to help you. |
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Rain In The Face
