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joe wiggs
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
 Posted - December 23 2011 : 11:25:23 AM
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Originally posted by AZ Ranger
I have read many Indians accounts but no Indian testimony. Even at RCOI Indian accounts were introduced. The difference is that they were hearsay at RCOI and not testimony where they could have been charged with perjury as a person would be if making a knowingly false testimony.The error factors of translation, recollection errors, and retelling of accounts of nothing to do with the veracity of the person telling the account. It has everything to do with its accuracy. The Indians accounts are what they are. Just as Private Peter Thompson gave his account.
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Just a refresher regarding your erroneous denial of Indians being capable of giving "testimony" which you have recently denied. In fact, after i patiently explained the gross error of your ways, you responded back that you were "glad i was coming around to your way of thinking."
Since the original sources are dead and the translators if they were used are dead then it is up to each individual to place the weight they feel appropriate to the accounts.
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The writers of the Bible are dead. Many writers of the history of World War 11 are dead. The writers of many major compositions are dead and many people of many Nations confer an incredible belief in the works. Exactly what is your point?
So the bottom line is there any difference in Joe's meaning of an Indian statement, Indian account, and Indian testimony. No
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I believe you just may be insane. It was you and that obnoxious buddy of yours who insisted there was a difference. It was I who proved (via Webster's dictionary) that you both were wrong. Lord AZ, do you not understand that people have to merely read these posts and know that you are a Liar?
I chose to hold a higher standard to someone who takes an oath to tell the truth. Apparently Joe does not therefore his use of testimony has no measure of accountability anymore than someone bragging about how good he was in any particular event.
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What you and I choose to believe is subjective and therefore meaningless. I responded to your inane commitment that Indian information as to what happened at the battle was not "Testimony."
Since Joe sees no difference between testimony and account why did use testimony instead of account in his poll question. Since he has been in the discussion of testimony v. account then he can no longer claim ignorance. Does he feel his poll would have a different meaning if he substitute account or statement for testimony? Or does he really hold a different standard when he uses the word testimony?
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See what I mean!
AZ Ranger
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joe wiggs
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 23 2011 : 11:27:57 AM
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| An officer's first duty is to his men! An officer in Viet nam who adhered to your philosophy would have been fragged. by the way, you where in Viet-Nam, right? |
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AZ Ranger
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 23 2011 : 12:49:31 PM
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That saying is from the cavalry not one I made up. So your beef on that would be with the US Cavalry and not me. On the other board I changed it to a mounted officer for police work on horseback. In that case a officer is an individual and does not not refer to rank per se. I think the canine officers have a similar feeling toward thier dog.
Just so you know we did not use horses in Viet Nam in the Marines that I recall but since you want to go into Marine Corps stuff refresh youself with the rifle creed.
This is my rifle. There are many like it, but this one is mine. It is my life. I must master it as I must master my life. Without me my rifle is useless. Without my rifle, I am useless. I must fire my rifle true. I must shoot straighter than the enemy who is trying to kill me. I must shoot him before he shoots me. I will. My rifle and I know that what counts in war is not the rounds we fire, the noise of our burst, or the smoke we make. We know that it is the hits that count. We will hit.
My rifle is human, even as I am human, because it is my life. Thus, I will learn it as a brother. I will learn its weaknesses, its strengths, its parts, its accessories, its sights and its barrel. I will keep my rifle clean and ready, even as I am clean and ready. We will become part of each other.
Before God I swear this creed. My rifle and I are the defenders of my country. We are the masters of our enemy. We are the saviors of my life.
So be it, until victory is America's and there is no enemy.
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“ An officer's first duty is to his horses.”
SEMPER FI |
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AZ Ranger
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 23 2011 : 12:52:14 PM
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No man will follow you merely because of the official relationship. If you want the trust of your men, and their devotion and belief in you, you must treat them as human beings [...] The foundation of human life is food. The first duty of an officer is to look after his horse because it is dumb, then to look after his men and see that they are comfortably housed and fed, and, not until he has done this, to look after his own wants.
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“ An officer's first duty is to his horses.”
SEMPER FI |
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AZ Ranger
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
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AZ Ranger
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 23 2011 : 1:10:24 PM
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I am sure that in the cavalry when they took breaks and went into camp they took care of the horses first. The same was true of a Marine and his rifle that it was taken care before eating or sleeping don't you think?
First duty implies nothing about what I think you are trying to get at. You can't be cavalry without a horse so you must maintain the horse and that occurs first before other duties. In the Marine Corps you can't be a Marine without a rifle so therefore it comes first.
AZ Ranger |
“ An officer's first duty is to his horses.”
SEMPER FI |
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joe wiggs
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 23 2011 : 11:01:49 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by AZ Ranger
No man will follow you merely because of the official relationship. If you want the trust of your men, and their devotion and belief in you, you must treat them as human beings [...] The foundation of human life is food. The first duty of an officer is to look after his horse because it is dumb, then to look after his men and see that they are comfortably housed and fed, and, not until he has done this, to look after his own wants.
I see, someone held you hostage and forced you to use this slogan huh? The beef remains with you because you could have chosen a thousand sayings like "god Bless America." No, you decided on a line that teaches us the caring of a horse exceeds the wants of a fellow human being. |
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joe wiggs
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 23 2011 : 11:07:01 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by AZ Ranger
No man will follow you merely because of the official relationship. If you want the trust of your men, and their devotion and belief in you, you must treat them as human beings [...] The foundation of human life is food. The first duty of an officer is to look after his horse because it is dumb, then to look after his men and see that they are comfortably housed and fed, and, not until he has done this, to look after his own wants.
Az, are you on drugs? Are you telling me that if a superior officer gave you an order you would only obey it if you were devoted to him? I would wager that tomorrow if a superior officer you had never met (id you were a current member of the armed forces) told you to drop and give twenty you would drop, immediately,and knock off twenty, I know I would! |
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AZ Ranger
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 24 2011 : 01:15:09 AM
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If I recall correctly you dropped out.
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“ An officer's first duty is to his horses.”
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AZ Ranger
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 24 2011 : 01:24:55 AM
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Again that is another quote from a cavalry officer. Funny that you can't understand it. Seems odd to me that you continue to lecture about being childish and yet you're always the one starting something. For instance the comments about an officers duty.
“ An officer's first duty is to his horses.”
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“ An officer's first duty is to his horses.”
SEMPER FI |
Edited by - AZ Ranger on December 24 2011 01:27:25 AM |
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AZ Ranger
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 24 2011 : 01:30:55 AM
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You do understand that the following is a quote of a cavalry officer:
"No man will follow you merely because of the official relationship. If you want the trust of your men, and their devotion and belief in you, you must treat them as human beings [...] The foundation of human life is food. The first duty of an officer is to look after his horse because it is dumb, then to look after his men and see that they are comfortably housed and fed, and, not until he has done this, to look after his own wants."
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“ An officer's first duty is to his horses.”
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AZ Ranger
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 24 2011 : 01:45:28 AM
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Here is another quote dealing with a point you were trying to make and I think wrong. I bolded the part the medal of honor winner states in difference to your posted opinion.
"By CSM Gary L. Littrell, US Army (ret.), MOH
I often think back to when I was a young NCO, a young buck sergeant in 1964
at the ripe age of 19 years old. I remember asking myself what would it take
for me to be a great NCO? We didn’t have NCO Academies. We didn’t have
noncommissioned officer guides. We had the experience of our senior NCOs
and we had the day to day task of asking ourselves whether we wanted to be
good sergeants and if so what would it take to make us good sergeants. And I thought the number one thing to becoming the best NCO I could be was to be respected. You see, respect is something that has to be earned. Respect is notissued to you with a set of orders and a set of stripes. Respect is something youearn by taking care of the soldiers that you train and supervise and prepare for
combat.
One of |
“ An officer's first duty is to his horses.”
SEMPER FI |
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AZ Ranger
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 24 2011 : 01:51:51 AM
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| Is it that you don't understand the difference between ordered by an officer and following an respected officer? |
“ An officer's first duty is to his horses.”
SEMPER FI |
Edited by - AZ Ranger on December 24 2011 01:58:35 AM |
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AZ Ranger
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 24 2011 : 02:18:35 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by joe wiggs
quote:
Originally posted by AZ Ranger
No man will follow you merely because of the official relationship. If you want the trust of your men, and their devotion and belief in you, you must treat them as human beings [...] The foundation of human life is food. The first duty of an officer is to look after his horse because it is dumb, then to look after his men and see that they are comfortably housed and fed, and, not until he has done this, to look after his own wants.
I see, someone held you hostage and forced you to use this slogan huh? The beef remains with you because you could have chosen a thousand sayings like "god Bless America." No, you decided on a line that teaches us the caring of a horse exceeds the wants of a fellow human being.
I'll chose anything that I like. Again your ignorance shows since it does not mean that at all. It sets the order of duties to preform but has nothing to do with caring. We didn't hold hands and give hugs in the Marine Corps but we made sure our rifles were ready as a first duty. |
“ An officer's first duty is to his horses.”
SEMPER FI |
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joe wiggs
Brigadier General
USA
Status: offline |
Posted - December 27 2011 : 8:54:04 PM
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Why don't you take a survey and see what people generally thought about your slogan before you explained it. You see AZ, the vast majority of slogans are self explanatory;hence the name "slogan."
Now I won't argue with you about me being "ignorant" as all of us (including you) have been guilty of a boner or two. Regardless, a belated merry Christmas to you and your family. |
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Validity/Non-validity of Indian Testimony
