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deerslayer
Pathfinder
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October 02 2005
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 Posted - November 08 2005 : 6:45:01 PM
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I have been wandering if it would be period correct or is there any documentation of centerseam mocs that where extended up right below the knee. Im not talking about a shoepack just a regular center seam extended upwards.Just an idea.
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Stryker16
Pathfinder
USA
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October 06 2005
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Posted - November 09 2005 : 09:26:28 AM
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The tallest I have ever seen extended just past the ankle, much like a high top gym shoe. I personally haven't seen any documentation to mocs that tall. The only place I have ever seen them was Hollywood. The tallest mocs I've seen documented were Fort Ligonier shoe packs, and they went up to mid-calf length. Seems to me they would be difficult to make of the changing angle between foot and leg and since they were sewn without laces they would be hard to take off and put on. It certainly is possible, I seen documentation, were some Indians would have there leggings sewn to fit there legs, where they stayed until the rotted off.
Mark |
Mark
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deerslayer
Pathfinder
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Posted - November 09 2005 : 5:19:43 PM
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Thanks alot stryker.You said they would be hard to take off and puton because they were sewn without laces.I thought they just wrapped around the calf and then a tie was tied around to hold them up.
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Stryker16
Pathfinder
USA
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Posted - November 10 2005 : 07:45:46 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by deerslayer
Thanks alot stryker.You said they would be hard to take off and puton because they were sewn without laces.I thought they just wrapped around the calf and then a tie was tied around to hold them up.
I seen that done on shoe packs, but not center seam. I emailed a buddy of mine who makes his own. I'll let you know what he says. |
Mark
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Stryker16
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USA
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Posted - November 11 2005 : 07:52:44 AM
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My buddy did not know of anything either. Another source provided me with these references
Doddridge remembered:
"They were mostly made of a single piece with a gathering seam along the top of the foot, and another from the bototm of the heel,, without gathers as high as the ankle joint or a little higher. Flaps were left on each side to reach some distance up the legs. These were nicely adapted to the ankles, and, lower part of the leg by thongs of deer skin, so that no dust, gravel, or snow could get with the moccason (sic)."
Isaac Weld recalled in 1799:
"...by means of a thong it is fastened round the instep, just under the ankle-bone, and is thus made to sit very close to the foot. Round that part where the foot is put in, a flap of the depth of an inch or two is left, which hangs loosely down over the string by which the moccasin is fastened;..." |
Mark
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Fitzhugh Williams
Mohicanland Statesman
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Posted - November 11 2005 : 09:54:26 AM
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| Something else to keep in mind. Mocs were expendable. Sometimes they would only last a day. The less material you use in a moc, the more you can make out of one skin. Sometimes, when the mocs with the fancy decorated flaps wore out, the flaps would be cut off and sewn to a new pair. Mocs could be repaired, but even then they would not last long. Leggings, on the other hand, would last a long time. So making the leggings separate from the mocs, and making the mocs as small as possible would get more usage out of a piece of leather. Now, for ceremonial usage, all bets are off! |
"Les deux pieds contre la muraille et la tete sous le robinet" |
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deerslayer
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Posted - November 12 2005 : 6:21:43 PM
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| I would think mocs would last longer than a day.I know they aren't the most durable peices of foot wear but I would have thought they would have last longer.My center seams have lasted me a long time through hunts and treks.But have needed a few of repairs. |
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Fitzhugh Williams
Mohicanland Statesman
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Posted - November 13 2005 : 01:41:44 AM
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| The thing about lasting one day was if a person was constantly on the move, walking from morning to night. And they were probably made of deer hide, which is not as durable as moose or elk, but around here, there would have been no moose or elk, so deer was it. Today, we probably take better care of mocs, and probably spend a lot more time in making them than someone who was on the move 250 years ago. |
"Les deux pieds contre la muraille et la tete sous le robinet" |
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Stryker16
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Posted - November 14 2005 : 09:25:24 AM
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| There are also accounts of folks making moccassins out of "Green" Leather. This was leather that had been scraped, stretched and dried but not tanned. I think the account I read said it would last about 2 days. |
Mark
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Fitzhugh Williams
Mohicanland Statesman
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Posted - November 14 2005 : 11:13:54 AM
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| I have heard that too. And it makes a lot of sense. Why spend time tanning the leather when it is going to be used up so quickly. |
"Les deux pieds contre la muraille et la tete sous le robinet" |
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deerslayer
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Posted - November 15 2005 : 5:05:12 PM
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| It does make more sense then spending all that time tanning. |
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Stryker16
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USA
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Posted - November 16 2005 : 09:35:15 AM
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| But tanning the hide Will make the mocs last longer. They will develope holes the need to be patched, which are often mentioned in journals. But a green hide will literally rot off your feet from the sweat interacting with the skin. They were sort of a make do shoe when tanned leather was not available. |
Mark
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center seam mocs
