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Kaylynn44
Mohicanite
USA
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 Posted - May 17 2004 : 6:11:24 PM
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I was watching Oprah today, and she went back in time to the 1600's. There is a place in Maine where they have a little colony that they do everything like they would have done in the 1600's. It looked really rough, and I just don't believe that I have the stamina or the stomach to put up with alot of stuff that they put up with.
Anyway, "Colonial House" will air on PBS tonight if anyone wants to watch it. It really does make you think about what our forefathers had to go through. It wasn't easy!!!
Kay
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~ An Infinite Zephyr~
Some things never end
As long as goodness exists
Winds shall always soothe
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Theresa
Bumppo's Tavern Proprietress
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Posted - May 17 2004 : 7:45:12 PM
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I posted about this a few days back, Kay. Here's a small description:
On Monday, PBS again hits the button on the time machine and sends a new group of 21st century people into a re-creation of a long-lost era.
This time, the goal is to build a town, which was the task facing English settlers arriving in the New World in 1628. "Colonial House", airing over four nights, tracks the five-month ordeal of American and British participants as they struggle to keep warm, feed themselves, and survive on an isolated stretch of the Maine coastline, living with the tools, technology, and traditions of the time.
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Kaylynn44
Mohicanite
USA
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Posted - May 17 2004 : 7:57:04 PM
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Theresa,
I didn't see your post, or if I did, I forgot that I read it. Getting older, ya know.  Are you going to watch it? I think that I will probably tape it since it continues for four nights. I thought that it was only on tonight. It looks like it will be very interesting.
Kay |
~ An Infinite Zephyr~
Some things never end
As long as goodness exists
Winds shall always soothe
www.cloudsbooks.com
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Theresa
Bumppo's Tavern Proprietress
USA
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Posted - May 17 2004 : 8:58:22 PM
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| Hey Kay...just watched the first hour and I must say I'm hooked. This is going to be extremely moving to say the least. Hope everyone gets to see it. |
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Kaylynn44
Mohicanite
USA
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Posted - May 17 2004 : 9:18:32 PM
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Theresa,
I have it taping. It looked interesting from what I saw on Oprah today, so I knew that I would have to watch it. Can you even think of living like that? I have to say that I am too attached to modern conveniences. Four months without a computer??? I don't think so!!!
Kay |
~ An Infinite Zephyr~
Some things never end
As long as goodness exists
Winds shall always soothe
www.cloudsbooks.com
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Theresa
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USA
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Posted - May 17 2004 : 10:15:32 PM
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| A few years back, our fifth graders created a Colonial Village, beginning after Christmas break and it all came to fruition prior to Spring Break. For two days, they and all the school staff were dressed colonial and lived colonial...we had an apothocary, a milliner shop, and silversmith, blacksmith, carpenter, quilters, cooks, a tavern, dancers, candle makers, caligraphers, a militia, and probably other things I've forgotten about. The students did extensive research and literally became colonists. What a learning experience. I remember telling my husband while we were doing this that I believe I must have lived back in that time because I was so involved and LOVED doing it...however!! I truly do not believe I could have actually gone through and done all that was necessary in order to survive. I don't know how they did it. |
Theresa |
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Fitz Williams
Colonial Militia
USA
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May 19 2002
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Posted - May 18 2004 : 01:47:39 AM
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This was posted on two other web sites.
"Please allow me to publicly apologize for all Native people in regards to that sham of a grouping of Passamaquody guys. What was up with that? They looked like they stopped at the souveneir shop on the way to the shoot!
Bone hairpipe chokers and sharpie-marker drawings on leather laced vests? OMG. I was appalled as was my wife. THEN they show up later in street clothes! Why weren't they in those ace clothes from before? They would have been better off not showing themselves at all.
I am humiliated as a Native American and doubly so because my job is in the bureau of historic sites and accuracy must have flown out the window.
This just prooves that we have to educate our own people so that when a culturally sensitive production comes along and wants input from the Native POV it is done right.
I don't blame PBS at all. They did the right thing by getting the Native people's help. And I guess the Natives they (PBS) went too are at that stage in their own revitalization and cultural awareness. It's a funny thing about the east coast Native people and how much they have had to endure. It's amazing really that they exist at all."
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Seamus
Guardian of Heaven's Gate
USA
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Posted - May 18 2004 : 05:30:15 AM
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Good post, Fitz, thanks! I had the same reaction when I saw the Passamaquody. I was quite surprised that PBS allowed that to happen, although I guess I shouldn't have been.
My 'jury is still out' on this show. Some things I was impressed with, most I was not.......absolutely LOVED the houses. Kept putting myself there.......wondered who I could tolerate, which ones I could get close to, and which I definitely would not.......and there definitely are a couple of candidates.  
All in all, I was not thrilled with the show,(I'll give it a C- at this point) but will ride it out awhile longer and see if it improves. |
Life's journey is not to
arrive at the grave safely
in a well preserved body,
but rather to skid in sideways,
totally worn out, shouting
'...holy sh*t ...what a ride!'
~~Mavis Leyrer, Seattle
Seamus
~~Aim small, hit the b*****d right between the eyes!~~ |
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Theresa
Bumppo's Tavern Proprietress
USA
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Posted - May 18 2004 : 07:01:55 AM
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| You know...I reckon it's a good thing we have educated folk here to point out the inaccuracies in this sort of project. Thanks. I didn't know about the Passamaquody...and my take was if the colonists were to be as authentic as possible, then why not the Natives? And I'm with you, Seamus, there's a couple of folk that touched a bit on the nerves. One thing that really came home to me was the suffering these people endured. Your take on the narration?..Anybody? |
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Theresa
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Posted - May 18 2004 : 07:03:25 AM
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| OH! One more thing...did you see the preview for Wes's upcoming next installment of the Tony Hillerman novels? July 11. |
Theresa |
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Kaylynn44
Mohicanite
USA
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Posted - May 18 2004 : 07:19:30 AM
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I'm going to watch it today, but I would be like Thersa and not really know if there was any inaccuracies regarding hte Passamaquody.
I still think that it is interesting that anybody would go that far to relive history.
Kay |
~ An Infinite Zephyr~
Some things never end
As long as goodness exists
Winds shall always soothe
www.cloudsbooks.com
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Seamus
Guardian of Heaven's Gate
USA
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Posted - May 18 2004 : 07:52:28 AM
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Theresa, these modern folk have not yet begun to suffer! One thing that struck me, and really made me chuckle, was the gal in the grocery store with her pile of groceries at the checkout! My thought was, "Heheheh.......just you wait, Honey. You have NO IDEA what you are about to endure."
We cannot imagine the hardships those who came here in the 17th century had to deal with. And remember, too, that there was no TV crew lurking around them ready to take them home if they couldn't hack it. They died.........and miserably!! "I really miss my boyfriend," just didn't cut it. |
Life's journey is not to
arrive at the grave safely
in a well preserved body,
but rather to skid in sideways,
totally worn out, shouting
'...holy sh*t ...what a ride!'
~~Mavis Leyrer, Seattle
Seamus
~~Aim small, hit the b*****d right between the eyes!~~ |
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Wilderness Woman
Watcher of the Wood
USA
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Posted - May 18 2004 : 08:17:57 AM
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Well I went into this one, having watched Frontier House and Manor House (I think it was), knowing full well that there would be a lot of moaning, groaning, b****ing and complaining. I wasn't disappointed!
Setting that aside, the major gripe with me was the way the women went around half-dressed! As I understand it, women didn't appear in public with their stays (corset) showing. No matter what the weather, they would have had something covering them. Am I correct, Seamus? And one girl was even playing ball in her shift!! Egads! The other thing was their hair. Even those women with shoulder-length hair could have kept it up in a bun, with a cap or kerchief to cover it.
Most moving part? For me it was the emotion shown by the "Governor" as he spoke of parents holding their children while they died.
Most pompous participant? The assistant governor/lay preacher. I can barely stand to listen to him talk.
Question: The girl who said she missed her boyfriend. Was she the one whose fiance was killed? Or was that her sister?
Like you, Seamus, I kept looking at those little houses and wondering what it would be like to live in one. |
"It is more deeply stirring to my blood than any imaginings could possibly have been." |
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Fitz Williams
Colonial Militia
USA
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May 19 2002
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Posted - May 18 2004 : 09:01:40 AM
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| There was one house they showed which had no chimney, but the top of the eves was open to let out the smoke. That is the way the Indian house at Fort Loudoun is built. The trick is to get the proper opening on the door, so that the smoke will draw to the eves. Works pretty well once you get the hang of it. The houses seem to be built with split boards. I wonder if the original colonists would have taken the time to split the lumber. And the planting of the corn, are they doing the "three sisters" planting (corn, beans, squash)? So much moaning and complaining. It makes me wonder why the came in the first place. |
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Seamus
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Posted - May 18 2004 : 11:36:22 AM
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Well, WW, not being a girl, I am not totally up to speed on girl stuff,particularly 17th c. girl stuff, but I do know that stays/corsets, etc., would not be worn exposed in public. AND!!!! In no way would a young female be out playing in her underwear, which is what a shift is! The Puritan mindset would certainly not have tolerated that!
The Lay Minister is definitely a strange breed of cat......I think a real Puritan would have made the 'swimmers' pay dearly for leaving their work to go off and swim, not merely stand and watch.
WW, I don't know which girl lost her fiance. I fell asleep and missed that part! Shows you how interesting it was for me! The one who made the remark is the younger one, I believe. She has gorgeous full dark eyebrows, and I think she is the one who milked the goat (or goatess!).
Fitz, they did not plant a Three Sisters garden, only maize. I saw nothing to lead me to believe otherwise. The boards on the houses would have been split, I am sure. It would be much faster than sawing them in a pit saw. Sure were alot of gaps.....saw a couple almost big enough to throw a cat through! Ha! They think they are cold now! Wait until winter sets in.....but I suppose they won't last that long. (Hey! How about a Donner Pass reality show??)
OH, WELL......Plimoth Plantation had only 2 weeks to get these folks ready for a tough job, and so far, it shows. Maybe it will get better as time passes. Unfortunately, I will miss the next 2 nights, so you all pay attention and fill me in!
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Life's journey is not to
arrive at the grave safely
in a well preserved body,
but rather to skid in sideways,
totally worn out, shouting
'...holy sh*t ...what a ride!'
~~Mavis Leyrer, Seattle
Seamus
~~Aim small, hit the b*****d right between the eyes!~~ |
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Wilderness Woman
Watcher of the Wood
USA
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Posted - May 18 2004 : 11:53:07 AM
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Seamus, the eldest daughter of the "Governor's" family, Bethany, received word that her fiance had been killed in a car accident. Also, the family's oldest son (who was not involved with the show) was seriously injured in the accident. That's why the whole family left suddenly. It really shook up the colony.
But then, you may have seen at the end of last night's show that the Governor came back. Whether the rest of the family will or not, remains to be seen.
Terrible, terrible tragedy. |
"It is more deeply stirring to my blood than any imaginings could possibly have been." |
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Fitz Williams
Colonial Militia
USA
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May 19 2002
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Posted - May 18 2004 : 1:06:59 PM
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"The boards on the houses would have been split, I am sure. It would be much faster than sawing them in a pit saw."
What I was thinking was that the logs would have been squared with a broad axe or adze, and not split or sawed. If you consider that they used overlapping borads, then the total amount of wood used would not have been that much different than if you squared the logs and chinked them. And you probably would have ended up with a much more air tight structure. I don't know anything about construction in New England during that period, so maybe the split boards were the norm. |
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Kaylynn44
Mohicanite
USA
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Posted - May 18 2004 : 4:56:09 PM
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I just watched the first part of Colonial House, and I liked it. I did see some things that should have been different. Like WW said about the hair and that they should have had it pulled back and covered. Some did, but some didn't.
It is only reasonable to hear them complain. You are taking people away from the comforts of home, and putting them in a place where you have to use leaves for toilet paper for four months!!! I would be complaining too!!!  I know that they volunteered for this, but I don't think that the mind can comprehend exactly how tough something like that is going to be.
There is only one thing that I think should have been different. I think that it should have been "adults only." I just don't think that it is fair to the kids to subject them to that. That is just my opinion. I felt so bad for the little blonde headed boy.
But, all in all, I thought that it was a good program.
Kay |
~ An Infinite Zephyr~
Some things never end
As long as goodness exists
Winds shall always soothe
www.cloudsbooks.com
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Scott Bubar
Colonial Militia
USA
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Posted - May 19 2004 : 07:00:12 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Fitz Williams
"The boards on the houses would have been split, I am sure. It would be much faster than sawing them in a pit saw."
What I was thinking was that the logs would have been squared with a broad axe or adze, and not split or sawed. If you consider that they used overlapping borads, then the total amount of wood used would not have been that much different than if you squared the logs and chinked them. And you probably would have ended up with a much more air tight structure. I don't know anything about construction in New England during that period, so maybe the split boards were the norm.
My understanding is that the houses were "pre-fabbed" by the Plimoth Plantation artisans, than erected on the site in Maine.
They are accurate for the period, but I think you'd generally see dugout homes to start with, then wooded sided homes later when they had the time and resources to build them. |
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Bookworm
Colonial Militia
USA
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Posted - May 19 2004 : 07:09:38 AM
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| Here's an author who agrees with you, Scott: "The dugout, used in the earliest days of settlement in New England, New Netherland, and Pennsylvania, was a cavelike shelter dug into the side of the hill, or a pit dwelling consisting of a rectangular excavation roofed over with poles and slabs of bark." -- Douglas Edward Leach, The Northern Colonial Frontier 1607-1763. |
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Wilderness Woman
Watcher of the Wood
USA
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Posted - May 19 2004 : 08:22:11 AM
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Well. So, what say ye about last night's episodes? Here are my thoughts:
I found it very emotional... Bethany, who lost her fiance, came back to a tearful, surprise reunion with her father. Her mother and younger brother came, also.
I found it entertaining in a very positive way... the mild-mannered governor who rules with a gentle iron fist; the contrite Englishman who went AWOL for a couple of days; the nervous indentured servant who made a very personal public announcement in church; the self-professed non-believers who gracefully accepted their punishment.
But most of all, it seems to me (so far, at least) that these people are really trying very hard to get along with each other, to obey the rules (for the most part), and to get done the work that is needed. I felt that they got a lot accomplished in the episodes last night, both physically and emotionally.
All in all, I am seeing far less complaining than I did in Frontier House. Criminees! That experiment even broke up a marriage! |
"It is more deeply stirring to my blood than any imaginings could possibly have been." |
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alikws
Colonial Settler
USA
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Posted - May 19 2004 : 4:33:02 PM
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the purpose of such shows is not to show how things were as much as to show how much has changed... the people who are selected have attributes that would not make them a first choice at a site like plimouth or colonial wiliamsburg, like athism , mixed race couples or vegitarians... plus the 'survivor' crowd likes conflicts and catfights... if reenactors were the persons selected, it probaly would be boring to all who are not reenactors...
the passamaquodys are not reenactors... their clothing is pretty much straight out of a modern powwow, period clothing would have been mantles, tight side seam leggins, breachclouts and center seam moccasins... one may have had a white linen shirt, and hair would have been not unlike magua... for weapons {notice complete lack of them in series} they would have had bows, ball headed warclubs {like magua} and maybe a dutch musket... i suspect some locals were asked at the last minute if they'd help out, rather then go through plimouth plantation/habbomocs homestead, but then you'd have wampanoag reenactors which isnt completely right either...
saw only the first two shows at my parents, can't get pbs at my place,even if i had electricity... proof i'd be a bad choice for the show... anybody hear of rebroadcast dates? |
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Fitz Williams
Colonial Militia
USA
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May 19 2002
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Posted - May 19 2004 : 9:12:22 PM
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| I looked up the next episodes to see when they aired. Next Monday and Tuesday. It said the Colony gets a new Governor, namely the lay preacher with the fuzzy white beard and the $%^#$$ wife. And management from the sponsoring company decides to check up on the Colonies production, so they scramble to produce more spars, fish and clams. The more Indians appear, this time the Wampanoag. Maybe they will use different actors. Or maybe they will just go to a different souvenir shop this time. And the harvest is a success. Well who'ed have thunk it! Oops, I hope I haven't spoiled the suspense for you. Personally, I can't wait for next Monday to arrive. |
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Kaylynn44
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Posted - May 19 2004 : 9:25:13 PM
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Well. So, what say ye about last night's episodes?
WW,
I watched most of last night's program, but I missed the part about the girl, I can't remember her name, left the show. Why did she leave?
I really liked what I saw last night too, but I figured that they were going to kick the guy who went into town off the show, but they didn't.
It said the Colony gets a new Governor, namely the lay preacher with the fuzzy white beard and the $%^#$$ wife
Fitz,
I feel the same way about the lay preacher's wife. Just don't care for her too much. I really like the governor that they have now. He is very understanding and tries to be as fair as he can.
Kay |
~ An Infinite Zephyr~
Some things never end
As long as goodness exists
Winds shall always soothe
www.cloudsbooks.com
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Theresa
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Posted - May 20 2004 : 07:04:52 AM
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| Did these people sign on to do this to really know what it was like in the 1600's? If so, they've brought way too much 21st century baggage with them. IMO.. |
Theresa |
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Wilderness Woman
Watcher of the Wood
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Posted - May 20 2004 : 07:56:45 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Kaylynn44
...I missed the part about the girl, I can't remember her name, left the show. Why did she leave?
Kay, I assume you are referring to the black girl? As I recall, they did not say why she left, but it sounded to me as though it was planned in advance... perhaps she had another committment and went into it knowing that she would not be able to stay the entire time.
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Colonial House on PBS
