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Monadnock Guide
Council of Elders
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]:
March 14 2005
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Fitzhugh Williams
Mohicanland Statesman
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]:
July 17 2005
Status: offline
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 Posted - March 05 2010 : 4:11:27 PM
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quote:
Federal accountants, for example, perform work that has more complexity and requires more skill than accounting work in the private sector, she says.
Really? Could have fooled me! |
"Les deux pieds contre la muraille et la tete sous le robinet" |
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Monadnock Guide
Council of Elders
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]:
March 14 2005
Status: offline
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Posted - March 05 2010 : 5:25:10 PM
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| I hear ya' Fitz, - what's really doing towns/cities in, is the benefit package on top of good salaries. What takes it to a TOTALLY different level, is the retirement package. In some cases almost unbelievable bennies. We have some cops & firefighters "going out" here before they're even 50 years old. While the rest of us plug along until 65ish paying our own way, and theirs too. - Until a near public mutiny last year down in Mass. - someone working roughly 18 years in the "car mens union" (bus & train drivers etc.) could retire in their 40's, with a benefit package that would knock most folks over - unbelievable. Nice alright, unless you're the guy paying the freight. |
you can keep "The Change" |
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richfed
Sachem
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]:
May 13 2002
Status: offline
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Posted - March 06 2010 : 10:25:36 AM
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| One must remember, at least in my opinion, cops and firemen are grossly underpaid - in most, if not all, jurisdictions. An excellent pension is the least we can do for them. Their life is on the line every day. They are [under]paid to confront disasters while the rest of us can run away. Good salaries? Yes, but not so great as to pay for a life. As for bus drivers, etc., including us postal workers, you my have a point. |
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Fitzhugh Williams
Mohicanland Statesman
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]:
July 17 2005
Status: offline
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Posted - March 06 2010 : 10:34:42 AM
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| Talking mainly about accountants. |
"Les deux pieds contre la muraille et la tete sous le robinet" |
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Monadnock Guide
Council of Elders
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]:
March 14 2005
Status: offline
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Posted - March 06 2010 : 7:11:12 PM
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Rich, - I understand what you're saying about the police & fire fighters,and I agree to a point. Those bus drivers I mentioned, can retire with somewhere around $34-$35,000.00 after only 23 years now, with a bennie package you wouldn't believe, while still in their 40's. Virtually all get another job, for decades after "their so-called retirement". I certainly have no problem with someone changing jobs after 10-20 years, but lets' not confuse a job change with retirement. And to "automatically" have ALL you health costs covered for the rest of your life??? Just because you worked for a municipality or Uncle Sam??? Try that in private industry, ... We've slowly become "two Americas". Here in New Hampshire now, a law suit is going to be filed next week, - by the teachers union, FD & PD unions, city/town unions, over 240 towns & cities going after the state for "wanting" to cut back the contribution to retirement funding of towns, from 35% to 30%. It's not carved in granite anywhere that the state HAS to contribute 35%, but they've been doing that and any "thought of change" is going to be fought.
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About three years ago, in Merrimack, N.H. the teachers were up for a new contract. As part of that, they wanted a "guarantee" that any & all losses in their retirement account from involvement (read losses) in the stock market - would be made up by the town. While they could reap any increases, - they wouldn't suffer any losses, the tax payer would instead.
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I'd love to think this problem was strictly local, ... ;)
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Monadnock Guide
Council of Elders
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]:
March 14 2005
Status: offline
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Posted - March 06 2010 : 7:33:06 PM
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Something from Casey Research that I posted on another board.
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Dear Reader,
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About a month ago we ran the following chart, which shows total nonfarm employment and private employment on the left axis and government employment on the right axis. As you can plainly see, over the past three years total nonfarm employment and private employment has trended lower, while government employment has trended higher.
Here are the specifics:
Total nonfarm employment is down 4.6% since January 2007, reflecting a decline of 6.27 million jobs.
Private-sector employment has fallen 5.8% and lost 6.625 million jobs.
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Total government employment climbed 1.6% over the past three years and added 355k jobs.
Meanwhile, federal government employment (not shown on the chart) rose 3.7% and tacked on 100k jobs over the analyzed period.
What we stumbled upon when we ran the chart but failed to discuss at the time is the idea that there really are two separate Americas, the private sector and the public sector.
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While the private sector has been devastated during this recession, the public sector has flourished.
Consider some evidence put together by Dr. Mark J. Perry.
According to this report from the BLS, state and local government employers spent an average of $39.83 per hour worked ($26.24 for wages and $13.60 for benefits) for total employee compensation in September 2009. Total employer compensation costs for private-industry workers averaged $27.49 per hour ($19.45 for wages and $8.05 for benefits). Translation: government employees make about 45% more on average than private-sector employees.
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This report from the BLS indicates that compensation for private-industry workers has increased by 6.9% between December 2006 and December 2009, compared to a 9.8% increase for state and local government workers over the same period. Translation: government compensation has grown more than 40% faster than private compensation over the past three years.
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And this story by USA Todays Dennis Cauchon reveals that the number of federal workers earning six-figure salaries has exploded during the recession. Federal employees making salaries of $100,000 or more jumped from 14% to 19% of civil servants during the recession's first 18 months and that's before overtime pay and bonuses are counted The highest-paid federal employees are doing best of all on salary increases. Defense Department civilian employees earning $150,000 or more increased from 1,868 in December 2007 to 10,100 in June 2009, the most recent figure available. When the recession started, the Transportation Department had only one person earning a salary of $170,000 or more. Eighteen months later, 1,690 employees had salaries above $170,000. The trend to six-figure salaries is occurring throughout the federal government, in agencies big and small, high-tech and low-tech. Translation: No translation needed.
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One of the best terms Ive read to describe whats going on in these two Americas is Detroitification. Coined by Jack McHugh, Detroitification is defined as the hollowing out of the private economy to prop up unsustainable government establishments.
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Please dont read into this that I am somehow against public-sector workers. I dont judge anyone; its not a useful exercise. But the problem with this is that it can only go on for so long until were all screwed. In economic terms, the government cannot produce anything. (Youre free to think the government is productive, but I would recommend reading the life works of Ludwig von Mises and Murray Rothbard if you yearn for enlightenment.
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Thus, if this Detroitification continues, at some point the private sector will be too hollowed out to prop up the bloated government, and the whole thing will collapse. Food for thought
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Credit: Casey Research |
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winglo
Deerslayer
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]:
July 13 2007
Status: offline
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Posted - March 08 2010 : 11:24:03 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by richfed
One must remember, at least in my opinion, cops and firemen are grossly underpaid - in most, if not all, jurisdictions. An excellent pension is the least we can do for them. Their life is on the line every day.
Sorry, but I have to disagree with you, Rich. They didn't have to CHOOSE that profession, but they did. They knew what they were getting into. If they don't like the risk, they can quit. They shouldn't be on MY payroll for the rest of their lives because they decided to take a risky job. Life requires choices and if they choose a high risk profession, then they need to live with that choice. I am not against good pay while they are performing the risky job, i.e. while employed, but the pension stuff--forget it! |
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Seamus
Guardian of Heaven's Gate
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]:
May 19 2002
Status: offline
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Posted - March 08 2010 : 4:15:05 PM
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| I hope you never need one.............and, if you do, that he/she never gets hurt. |
Life's journey is not to
arrive at the grave safely
in a well preserved body,
but rather to skid in sideways,
totally worn out, shouting
'...holy sh*t ...what a ride!'
~~Mavis Leyrer, Seattle
Seamus
~~Aim small, hit the b*****d right between the eyes!~~ |
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BookwormMG
Deerslayer
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]:
August 12 2009
Status: offline
Donating Member |
Posted - March 09 2010 : 06:44:47 AM
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| I must go with Rich and Seamus on this one: We want to hire the best possible people as cops and firefighters, not daredevils who give no thought to the future. We'll get what we pay for, with salary, benefits, AND pensions. |
"Glory, glory, hallelujah, welcome to the future!" -- Brad Paisley |
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Monadnock Guide
Council of Elders
USA
Bumppo's Patron since [at least]:
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Status: offline
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