| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Bookworm |
Posted - September 19 2004 : 09:45:58 AM
But how did Hawkeye know that? He'd only seen Magua for a few seconds, in the middle of a brutal firefight, and he'd never heard him speak. Since Magua had been adopted into the Mohawk tribe (and his comments to Montcalm suggest that this had happened quite a few years earlier), he would presumably have adopted Mohawk ways of dress and decoration -- except for tattoos (thinking out loud here)? Adoption was practiced so extensively by the peoples of the Northeast that, even if it would have been possible in the distant past to distinguish a "pure" Mohawk from a "pure" Huron (and I don't know that there were distinct physical differences between them even then), it probably wouldn't have been possible to do so in 1757. Am I missing something here, or is Hawkeye's ability to distinguish Mohawks from Hurons at a glance just a figment of the script writer's imagination? |
| 9 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| lonewolf |
Posted - November 02 2004 : 12:57:29 AM
You could generally tell at first glance that an Indian belonged to a certain nation, simply by looking at his moccasins. I look at re-enactors who tell me that they are Shawnee, then I look at their mocs, and I know that they are not portraying Shawnees. Also there are certain paint marks missing from their faces that tell me that they are not portraying Shawnees. I saw these errors at Fort Necessity. |
| Bookworm |
Posted - October 16 2004 : 09:35:02 AM
Thanks to everyone for the thought-provoking responses. I think WW's right that Diane hit the nail on the head -- Magua was fighting with, or even leading, a Huron war party, so the guys who "came upon a war party" recognized that he was Huron, too. In fact, now that I think about it, it seems pretty obvious...uh, DUH!!!!
Jacy, I think we'll have to admit that LOTM is ... well... not perfect regarding the historical facts. As Fitz Williams points out, the Hurons were no longer the great and powerful nation they had been in the 1600s. And when they WERE great and powerful, they were (contrary to the impression you get from the scene in the Huron village) no strangers to fur trading. There are references to the Huron "fleet" (of canoes) coming into MOntreal in the spring laden with furs. (Of the many past events I wish I could have witnessed, that is definitely one of them.) The Hurons lived at the northern edge of the region where the climate was suitable for growing corn, and they traded corn for furs with the peoples who lived to the north of them, then exchanged the furs for the European goods they wanted. There is even a book entitled "The Huron: Farmers of the North" -- certainly not the image Magua wanted to project! Anyway, when the Iroquois had depleted the supply of furbearers in their land, they began to covet the Hurons' position as middlemen in the fur trade, and the rest, as they say, is history...except in LOTM. |
| Fitz Williams |
Posted - September 21 2004 : 1:28:59 PM
quote:
Trading posts? Would Hawkeye not have met with other tribe members there?
Hawkeye lived in the lands of the Iroqois Confederacy, a place where no Huron would dare to tread. Or only in very large numbers, with lots of allies. |
| Kurt |
Posted - September 21 2004 : 07:57:47 AM
I think that Hawkeye recognized the Huron "family resemblance" of Magua. The tribes never were more than two thousand people in those days so features like faces, cheekbones, chins, noses, ears, ... would be similar within a tribe. When wars were fought, prisoners were adopted so Hawkeye would have the opportunity to learn what members of other tribes looked like.
When there is more time for observing, the manual skills like sewing moccasins, fletching arrows, and so forth can be used to identify someone's origin. What you learn as a child stays with you and remains "normal" way to do things even after adoption. I do not know enough about fighting styles or prefered weapons to know if that would be another clue. |
| Jacy |
Posted - September 21 2004 : 03:11:41 AM
Trading posts? Would Hawkeye not have met with other tribe members there?
Or - dare I say it - LOTM may not be as historically correct as it should be?
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| Fitz Williams |
Posted - September 21 2004 : 01:25:45 AM
quote:
someone who grew up in the Indian lifestyle... Hawkeye... would be able to tell that Magua was not dressed as a Mohawk
But Magua would probably have run into Mohawks at Albany and other places who would have picked up on any signs that he was not one of theirs, so I agree with Diane. He could only have been recognized as Huron because he was with a Huron war party. Which brings up another point. The Hurons had been defeated by the Iroquois Confederacy and driven into their most northern lands around Georgian Bay in 1649. Those that remained became the Wyandotte. So how would Hawkeye have been familiar with Huron dress? |
| Wilderness Woman |
Posted - September 20 2004 : 7:37:38 PM
By jove! I think she's got it! Good thinking, Diane!
I was wondering, too, if perhaps Magua had reverted back to his Huron ways, as it were, so that he was once again dressing and painting like them? The British, in their arrogance, probably would not recognize the difference, but someone who grew up in the Indian lifestyle... Hawkeye... would be able to tell that Magua was not dressed as a Mohawk. |
| Diane B. |
Posted - September 20 2004 : 1:02:58 PM
Here's another thought...Once Hawkeye, Chingachcook & Uncas "came upon the war party, tracked 'em" and then engaged in hand-to-hand combat with them on the George Road, they found themselves fighting against a Huron war party. The fact that Magua was fighting with that war party - despite his initial outward appearance as a Mohawk - would definitely be a determining factor in helping Hawkeye to state, with conviction, "He's no Mohawk - he's Huron!" |
| Jacy |
Posted - September 20 2004 : 10:01:24 AM
war paint, dress, facial markings, smell, tattoos - would they not help in distinguishing a Mohawk from a Huron.... I'm guessing that it must have been one or maybe all of these, because otherwise you could pose the question for many other battles that occured between different tribes? How did they know who was from their tribe and who was not??
Jacy :) |
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