| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| richfed |
Posted - August 31 2002 : 6:26:46 PM
A preliminary feeler - to be left up as an active poll for as long as is necessary.
What do you think of a Pennsylvania, F&I War-related, Gathering offshoot? It might very well include Jumonville Glen, Ft. Necessity, Ft. Duquesne/Ft. Pitt, Braddock's Battlefield, Ft. Ligonier, Kittanning, Bushy Run Battlefield; be centered at Old Bedford Village; and result in a very good time!
Why Pennsylvania? The list above shows why. Along with New York & Quebec, Pennsylvania was the "home" of the F&I War! [not to mention that a probable/possible organizer of such an event lives there!] No dates or time-frame, yet, but ...
Would you come? |
| 25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| grullo |
Posted - November 24 2006 : 06:03:55 AM
Lonewolf, did they give a reason you couldn't dress out at Bushy Run?I went several years ago and dressed out with no problem. No offence meant here but you might need to get some more historically correct clothing. There is also some Native politics come into play recently at some of the sites I work at and I know some of the Oklahoma amongst other tribes were interested in what was going on at Historic sites here in the east. |
| lonewolf |
Posted - October 29 2006 : 1:15:26 PM
Greetings Highlander,
I will "second" your opinion of the Governor of Pennsylvania. I have written to his office many times to complain about treatment of my Indian friends, as well as myself, at French and Indian sites in Pennsylvania, and in particular, Bushy Run Battlefield, where I was told that I could attend, but that I could not wear my Shawnee regalia to honor a 4x great grandfather, Willenawah (Great Eagle), who fought there, or my Shawnee people who died in battle there. My ancestors' blood literally permeates the fields there! I consider this to be a real "slap-in-the-face" to decendants of those who fought there!
I was not really welcome when I showed up in regalia to the 250th anniversary of the Battle at Fort Necessity, where the same Shawnee "grandfather", Willenawah fought with the French, and George Washington is a family ancestor through marriage! I was shunned by Park Service personnel whom I have known for years. It was a good day, but talking with some of the re-enactors, I understand that they greatly "restricted" the re-enactors as to what they could do there. I really don't know how to correct these sad situations for those of us who try to keep the history of these places alive, and present an awareness to the general public of the immense history of this great and pivotal State of Penna.? If we have to be restricted by the very Park Service people who should be appreciative of efforts of people like yourselves, and descendants of those who fought, such as myself, then much is being lost.
For the many letters I have written to the Governor, I have never received a response! I have also written letters of concern to the "Westsylvania" magazine, a fine publication who claims to support the local history of Westsylvania; and again, no response! Are legitimate questions not deserving of an answer? Is choosing to not respond not considered to be very bad manners. This type of non-response "is" bad manners among Indian people! I have always been cordial and non-threatening in my correspondence, but that doesn't seem to work, or illicit a response!
Most states have a "Representative for Indian Affairs"! Pennsylvania is one of the few who do not! As far as the Governor is concerned, there must be no Indians left in Penna., although we hold several pow-wows and gatherings in the state. Actually, there are thousands of us! We haven't gone anywhere! We just dress like everyone else when we go to work. And we all don't "look like" Geronimo. Never did! Most of us are now mixed-bloods, but that doesn't dilute the way we think.
I have discussed these matters with our "State Representative for Indian Affairs", here in North Carolina where I now reside, and he tells me that the Pennsylvania State Government is one whom is particularly hostile toward real Indians.
This whole situation of the Governor's sorry attitudes toward your re-enactors, as well as real Indians is really sad , especially since many scholars consider Pennsylvania to be the real "Cradle of America". And a state that decided the direction of how America would move forward as a Nation. Many of the most important engagements in the French and Indian War happened in Pennsylvania, and particularly in western Penna.
Much ofthe Revolution also took place in Penna.
Maybe you and I can get together and send the Governor a couple of history books! Obviously, he is not fully aware of the history of his own state.
As far as "money from history", has this Governor never visited places like Valley Forge? Or the historic sites Philadelphia, or the multitudes of tourists at re-enactments at Gettysburg, which brings several millions of dollars to the state of Pennsylvania? Has he never visited the Park Service sites suchas Fort Necessity, Fort Venango, Fort LeBeouf, or any of the other historic sites?
Maybe he is "sniffing" too many fumes from "Three Mile Island" that has affected his |
| Fitzhugh Williams |
Posted - October 28 2006 : 11:35:06 PM
And Lonewolf, I believe you live in Charlotte? There is a new site at Statesville, NC, on the 1756 location of Fort Dobbs. They have a garrison each month, but two larger events, one in October and one in April. The native side represents Cherokee, but most are actually of other nationalities. We could have used more Cherokee this fall. You might consider it. |
| Seamus |
Posted - October 28 2006 : 10:40:27 PM
Yes, Lonewolf, I was there, leading my Pennsylvanians, as usual, and quartered in the Officer's hut next to the Loyalhanna Street gate, our customary quarters. Also attending were Wilderness Woman, Sjt. Dammer ( if you have read Sjt. Munro's fine works you'd know his name),Sjt. Malcolm MacWilliam, Pvt. Davey Gunn and several of the other lads of the 77th...JohnsTon, Drummer Armstrong, young Christian, to name a few.
I am sorry I did not see you in the fort. I was Duty Officer right after the parade, so I would have been stationed in the Officer's Barracks headquarters wih Major Grant.
You are right...there were lots of attending public, and we gave them a good show! The volleys from both sides were crisp and 'spot on' making for a vicious sheet of flame across the lines. |
| lonewolf |
Posted - October 28 2006 : 8:48:44 PM
Sorry about the typosin my first post. I was in a hurry. I will have to spend more time proof reading. It was "Arthur St. Clair" from Ligonier that my people defeated in 1791. I let my fingers "do the walking" across the keyboard a little too quickly.
Question: were any of you at the re-enactment at Ligonier this October?
I was at the fort after the parade with a cousin who was dressed like George Washington. We made quite a sight for the tourists. Many photographed us together. They didn't believe that we are really cousins.
The crowd was really big at the fort. I could hardly see any of the battles.
I had a real good time, as always.
Take care. |
| lonewolf |
Posted - October 28 2006 : 2:37:18 PM
You may contact me at my home pertaining to any future events at my e-mail address: lonewlf99@aol.com
Take care |
| lonewolf |
Posted - October 28 2006 : 2:33:59 PM
Include me "in" for a "French and Indian War Gathering" in Pennsylvania. Or whatever you all come up with!
My Shawnee 4x great-grandfather, Willenawah (Great Eagle), fought with the French at Fort Necessity in 1754, and again at the Battle of the Monongahela in 1755 (the Shawnee would have fought with Gen. Braddock and the British, but Gen. Braddock insultd our Chiefs, so we fought with the French)! Willenawah also fought at Bushy Run against Col. Bouquet and his British forces in Pontiac's Rebellion in 1763 (I have the names of 265 Shawnees who survived this fight, one being a female warrior). Willenwah's wife, Elizabeth Gray, a red-haired, blue-eyed Scot (my 4x great grandmother), was captured in 1755 in western Maryland. During prisoner exchanges, she chose to stay with the Shawnees, was adopted, and became the wife of Willenawah! I wear her Sutherland Clan Scot Highlander sash on my regalia to honor her. Their children remained Shawnees and married within the Shawnees. My maternal grandmother carried their bloodlines.
Another 4x great grandfather was Chief White Peter of the Oneida Nation (late 1700's),of the Iroquois Six Nations. His wife Molly, was of the Seneca Nation. Chief White Peter was a captive white child (John Peter Klingensmith), taken in a raid at eight years of age by the Seneca at Fort Klingensmith (now Jeannette, Pa.), not far from Bushy Run. This was in 1781. He was given to the Oneida to raise, and became the only white chief that the Oneida have ever had. His wife was full blood Seneca. Chief White Peter fought with the British in Canada, against the U.S. in the War of 1812. My mother's father carried these bloodlines.
I attend Klingensmith family reunions in July near Bushy Run Battlefield. Some of us are the "Indian side of the family", and the rest descend from the first white settlers to the western Penna, frontier. Nice that we are no longer looking down gun barrels at each other!
Another of my ancestors, was a four year old white child, Jacob Kneisle, who was captured near Ligonier in about 1785, by the Wyandots (Hurons). He was raised Wyandot near Lake Erie. He had a Wyandot family. His Indian name was "Crow"! During the Indian removals in the 1830's, his family went to Oklahoma Territory, where his descendants still live. They are the Crow and Whitecrow families. They are my cousins.
In 1790, my Shawnee people defeated a U.S. Army under Gen. Harmar. In 1791, we defeated another U.S. Army under Gen. Arthur St, VClair of Ligonier fame.
I now march in the parade at Ligonier every October during Ligonier Days. I am invited by a cousin, Peggy Shepler, who co-ordinates this parade. I enjoy this event every year. I meet a couple of my re-enactor cousins at the fort. I am not a re-enactor, myself! When peole ask if I am a re-enactor, tell them "no, I am a real Shawnee". The incredulous looks that I get from them are wonderful! I do enjoy answering their questions about my heritage. Sad that there is little real American history being taught in our public schools.
I also have Native American cousins who are Seneca from Erie, Pa., Oneidas in the U.S. and Canada, Choctaws now from Pa., Shawnees in Pa. and Ohio, Munsees from Pa., and Chippewas from North Dakota!
There is an unbroken line from my Shawnee and Seneca-Oneida "grandfathers" through my Shawnee/Seneca-Oneida mother, to myself.
The Indian and white side of my families merged in the late 1800's to early 1900's, after the dust settled on all of the fights.
My father is of Pennsyvania Deutsche (German Amish) heritage. They are good people who live close to the earth. I was heartbroken when I heard of the recent school shootings of the innocent Amish girls!
One of my white ancestors on my father's side came to Pennsylvania on the same ship as William Penn. in the late 1600's. Half of the crew and passengers died of smallpox on the way from England to Philadelphia. The food and water w |
| Highlander |
Posted - May 17 2006 : 9:20:06 PM
quote:
Originally posted by pasmokepole
Pennsylvania would be a very good location for the gathering. More specifically, and not included in the list above, would be Fort Le Beouf - where the whole thing began. I don't know if Waterford, Pa would be able to handle any large crowds but nearby Erie (Fort Presque Isle - 20 minutes away) would certainly have accommadations/fairgrounds.
This area is also near Fort Machault/Venango (40 minutes away), and Fort Pitt (1.5 hours away), Fort Niagra (1.5 hours away), and Salamanca,NY (Iroquios Museum - 1 hour away, Kittanning (1.5 hours away). If the gathering were to be timed right, the Seneca Pow Wow in Salamanca is usually the fourth weekend in July. Would be great to include our native allies. Just some thoughts.
Being that this was first posted 4 years ago - I take it this event is not going to solidify.
Unfortunately,there is more to see and do for F&I in NY rather than PA. All of the sites that I've been to(Forts Ti and Niagara)have been reenactor friendly.I wish that I could say the same for sites in PA. As long as we have a Governor who believes "that there is no money to be made in history" we will continue to be lacking and far behind the other states in tourism. |
| Fitzhugh Williams |
Posted - May 17 2006 : 6:28:03 PM
And speaking of Fort Ticonderoga, or more properly Fort Carillon, one has to think that BIG things will happen there in 2008. This could be another opportunity. |
| Gadget Girl |
Posted - May 17 2006 : 4:29:40 PM
Having just been in Pennsylvania this past weekend and having been to Fort William Henry twice (Fort Ticonderoga once - EXCELLENT fort) I'd be all for a northern gathering.
Now to find a planner.....
GG  |
| Fitzhugh Williams |
Posted - May 17 2006 : 11:58:21 AM
Let's not forget that next summer is the 250th anniversary of the French victory at Fort William Henry on the shores of Lac Sacrement. I am sure that there will be a celebration of that event, and I plan to attend that one. Could we think "mini-Gathering" there? |
| pasmokepole |
Posted - May 17 2006 : 09:12:37 AM
Pennsylvania would be a very good location for the gathering. More specifically, and not included in the list above, would be Fort Le Beouf - where the whole thing began. I don't know if Waterford, Pa would be able to handle any large crowds but nearby Erie (Fort Presque Isle - 20 minutes away) would certainly have accommadations/fairgrounds.
This area is also near Fort Machault/Venango (40 minutes away), and Fort Pitt (1.5 hours away), Fort Niagra (1.5 hours away), and Salamanca,NY (Iroquios Museum - 1 hour away, Kittanning (1.5 hours away). If the gathering were to be timed right, the Seneca Pow Wow in Salamanca is usually the fourth weekend in July. Would be great to include our native allies. Just some thoughts.
Being that this was first posted 4 years ago - I take it this event is not going to solidify. |
| redarrow45 |
Posted - March 01 2006 : 09:57:04 AM
i would love to be there this summer |
| Highlander |
Posted - December 26 2005 : 8:18:40 PM
Sounds good to me.I'd be happy to help organize it. |
| ellen |
Posted - November 06 2005 : 02:02:32 AM
Hi All,
Southern California here. Sorry to say will probably have to pass on get together this summer. The Parker household is on baby-watch. First grandchild and all. Also, my parents are having their 65th wedding anniversary this summer and that means a large family get together. Jill and I had such a wonderful experience that we hate to pass up another chance but it just is not the best timing.
Ellen Parker
EDParker12@aol.com |
| Jeanneda |
Posted - October 24 2005 : 4:42:36 PM
Sounds good to me--fractured my hip Tuesday but so far so good--I think I am registered but I also thought there was only one stair left and there were two! Rich--am I registered?--Joan from CO that has the great Pyrenees dogs--my husband John comes with me.
Joan Lambert |
| SgtMunro |
Posted - January 24 2005 : 07:40:19 AM
quote:
Christina asked: another bit of trivia somebody might be able to clear up...was there ever some sort of military installation at what is now Pittsburgh called Fort Pitt?
Why yes there was, Christina. Pittsburgh, is the Anglacized form of Pittsboro or 'Fortified Town'. It was the name given to it by General Forbes in November of 1758, the now famous quote of the General, in his writtings to William Pitt, "...I have called this place, Pittsburgh." Fort Pitt was the final fort built at the Forks of the Ohio River (General Wayne's Fort Fayette was located further up the Allegheny River, on Liberty Avenue, near where today stands the Doubltree Hotel). It was also the largest and most advanced British-Built fort in North America. Designed for a garrison of 1,000 men, it would never see that many within its walls. The British occupied it until 1772, when it was turned over to the Colony of Virginia. Virginia occupied it until 1776 (Where it served as a 'Jumping-off' point for Lord Dunmore's War of 1774, against the Shawnee), at which time the Contenental Army (8th Pennsylvania Regiment) assumed command. After the American War of Independence (Circa 1783), Fort Pitt remained one of the only two active U.S. Army forts (West Point was the other) for the greatly reduced force. By the early 1790's, the walls had crumbled in a state of disrepair and the fort was again empty. This, and the site being prone to seasonal flooding, caused General Wayne to build further upriver, in preparation for his 1794 campaign against the Ohio Tribes.
I hope this helps answer your question. As Seamus said, I would be glad to help with giving you a list of 'places to see' here in SW Pennsylvania. If you read my historical-fiction, Fort Pitt plays a fairly sizable part in the drama. I am also writting a non-fiction work, which details the history of Fort Pitt, and the surrounding region.
Your Most Humble Servant,
|
| Christina |
Posted - January 22 2005 : 2:59:36 PM
Hi Seamus! Thanks for the information!!! You've just cleared up a lifelong question! And yes, I'm a long time Iron City fan. Would you believe there are so many Pittsburgh transplants down on our coast where I used to live that many of the bars in Myrtle/North Myrtle Beach have Iron City on tap???
Thanks for offering to help with some touring ideas...we basically have family all OVER the place around Pittsburgh and up into the Johnstown areas, but the primary areas...Dad's parents both are from the McKeesport area, with relatives who lived out in Glassport, East McKeesport, and rural area around Coulters. He also had family in Ligonier. Mom's family hailed mainly from area around Washington County including Burgettstown, Washington, Meadowlands, Langloth, Mcdonald ... but her father's people lived for a long time out near Imperial township outside Pittsburgh and also some were from around Zelionople. Some cousins live in Duquesne.
There are a LOT of us so we pretty much have offshoots just about anywhere you can look! |
| Seamus |
Posted - January 22 2005 : 11:40:37 AM
Hi Christina,
That phrase, "That's it! Fort Pitt!" is a catch phrase from an advertisement for Ft. Pitt Beer. The Pittsburgh Brewing Company made/makes Duquesne Pilsner and Iron City Beer. Iron City has lost most of its wonderful flavor, however, since they cleaned up the Monongehela River! (just kidding!)
Just read the other post also....where were your ancestors/relatives from? That might help in determining some good tours for you. Sjt. Munro and I can come up with some things for you, I am sure. Duncan? |
| Christina |
Posted - January 22 2005 : 10:14:07 AM
If this ever comes to fruition, I'd be more than glad to take part (see my earlier post of today...seeking F&I sources...) You can't imagine how ridiculous I felt when I discovered all these places I'd been driving by and heard about since I was a toddler (especially Fort Duquesne and the Kittanning area) had direct F&I ties...
another bit of trivia somebody might be able to clear up...was there ever some sort of military installation at what is now Pittsburgh called Fort Pitt? The reason I ask is that both my parents and all of my Pittsburgh-area relatives always used a phrase when telling us that something was over and done with: "That's it--Fort Pitt!" My dad still uses it. South Carolinians looked at us like idiots but it's a great phrase and would love to know where it comes from... |
| Okwaho |
Posted - January 16 2005 : 12:58:22 AM
Are you talking about an event for reenactors as a living history or a get together of anybody interested in the F&I War and the period ?
Tom Patton |
| alikws |
Posted - October 07 2004 : 10:43:24 AM
could be interesting, theres sites there i've never been to, and i don't know of any major events in
the works in that area, jumonville {early june} is a repeating event, fort pitt and duburque {sp??}
do somthing... definatly an odd year candidate... |
| wlogwihlas |
Posted - October 06 2004 : 10:56:25 PM
Sounds like a awesome idea. I am the Contact person for Woodland Confederacy, so I would love any info possible. This is the type of event our group likes. wlogwihlas@hotmail.com Walker Brook |
| Big Duncan MacLaren |
Posted - January 07 2003 : 11:37:32 PM
Liste --
I am ALL for a Pennsylvania gathering, BUT...
1) My Spring calendar is filling up FAST; and 2) my 16 year-old would-be-Hawkeye will be working at a BSA camp most of the Summer -- and I know better than to try and go w/o him!
So an autumn date looks attractive to me -- and there is no big Saratoga event to tie up September!
Your servant,
D. MacLaren, Pvt.
77th Grenadiers |
| SgtMunro |
Posted - October 24 2002 : 07:55:47 AM
Well, we'll have to relay it to Cousin Seamus. I'd vote for early fall of '03 or spring of any other year. I know most of the members of my regiment would probably be interested.
Your Humble Servant,
Sgt. Duncan Munro
Capt. Graham's Coy
1/42nd Royal Highlanders
"Nemo Me Impune Lacessit" |
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