| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Wilderness Woman |
Posted - January 02 2005 : 2:26:49 PM
This came through on the RevWar list:
No, It Wasn't French vs. Indians
January 1, 2005
By Glenn Collins, NY Times
Welcome to 2005: the Year of the French and Indian War.
Actually? Make that years, plural. The celebration is continuing through 2010.
It seems that New York would like to be known as the French and Indian War State, since it will serve as host of a national, and international, five-year-long commemoration of the many battles that took place within its borders.
Just exactly why are we supposed to care about this bicenquinquagenary?
"Well, for starters, this war is why we speak English and not French today," said Bob Bearor, a French and Indian War re-enactor from Newcomb, N.Y., who has written five books about New York as the bloody ground for French insurgent fighters and their Indian allies.
To history lovers, the conflict is increasingly seen as a crucible for the American Revolution and a war college for George Washington. "Most of the battles were fought in this state," Mr. Bearor added. "It was a war for an empire, and it changed the fate of the world."
The latest rediscovery of an under-heralded war prompted Gov. George E. Pataki to sign legislation in November creating the New York State French and Indian War 250th Anniversary Commemoration Commission, a 19-member group charged with organizing, promoting and carrying out a series of "re-enactment tourism events," the act says. The panel will also encourage studies of the French and Indian War from kindergarten through Grade 12 in New York State schools.
The unpaid commissioners are soon to be appointed, and meetings to determine a schedule of commemorative events will begin this winter.
"The battles of the French and Indian War," the governor said in a statement, "were the driving force for inspiring the values and ideals that led to the successful drive toward American independence, and the birth of freedom and democracy in the New World."
And there is always visitorship. The war's anniversary "is a major historic event that could be important for tourism upstate," said State Senator George D. Maziarz, Republican of Niagara County, who was a champion of the legislation. About that name: in Europe they call the French and Indian War the Seven Years' War. French Canadians call it la Guerre de Sept Ans. Other Canadians have termed it the War of the Conquest. And just like Civil War battles that were differently designated in the North and South, the New York conflicts have competing names above and below the Canadian border.
For example, Fort Ticonderoga was known by the French as Fort Carillon, and Lac du Saint Sacrement was renamed Lake George by the English in honor of their king.
It was Winston Churchill who, in "History of the English-Speaking Peoples," called the Seven Years' War the first world war, since it was the first conflict of European countries fought out in North America, the Caribbean, West Africa, India and the Philippines. But the war has often been relegated to footnote status, since "historians tended to write out everything that didn't lead directly to the Revolutionary War," said Dr. Fred Anderson, professor of history at the University of Colorado at Boulder and an expert on the Seven Years' War.
The French and Indian War was a flashpoint of the maritime and colonial conflict between France and England - which had previously been contending for domination of the North American continent for more than a century - and it began with a land dispute over control of the Ohio Valley.
None other than the inexperienced 22-year-old George Washington was a catalyst, triggering the war on May 28, 1754, when the contingent of Virginia soldiers and native warriors he was leading ambushed a French detachment and killed its commander, Joseph Coulon de Villiers, Sieur de Jumonville.
Though the French had many early vict |
| 25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| lonewolf |
Posted - January 15 2005 : 6:51:15 PM
Bookworm,
You may contact me at: lonewlf99@aol.com |
| lonewolf |
Posted - January 15 2005 : 6:32:53 PM
CCORNER,
You may contact me at lonewlf99@aol.com |
| lonewolf |
Posted - January 14 2005 : 11:39:12 PM
CCORNER,
One of my ancestors on my white grandmothers side (paternal)came from England on the same ship as did William Penn. I believe that the name of the ship was the "Friendship", which docked at Philadelphia. On the passage from England, about half of the passengers and crew died of smallpox. They had to be buried at sea (overboard). Only half of the number who set out from England arrived in Philadelphia. Penn eventually returned to England, but my Oxworth (Hawksworth) ancestor stayed. This line enters the Indian side of my family sometime in the late 1800's.
Another interesting story: my native ancestors were asked to help build one of the first log cabins in the area of Indiana, Penna. They and the white owner of the property toiled fort about three days, completing enough of the cabin that the Indians were no longer needed. They were paid in trade goods. The cabin owner was the 4x great grandfather of James Stewart, the late Hollywood actor. James is a family cousin. I visited his family's hardware store in Indiana, Penna. as a small boy. It is the only time that we visited. I believe that James was flying bombers in Europe at the time. It was during World War Two. There is a nice museum to James in Indiana, and it is worth the visit. Tell you some more later. Gotta run. |
| SgtMunro |
Posted - January 14 2005 : 07:57:39 AM
quote:
Lonewolf noted: Another of my white ancestors was Robert Morris, delegate from Pennsylvania, who signed the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. I believe that he is the only person to sign all three.
...And if memory serves me correct, he was instrumental in the raising and managing of monies which funded the American War of Independence. A truly under-appreciated and often forgotten patriot.
P.S.- Hope to see you at OBV this July.
Your Most Humble Servant, |
| ccorner |
Posted - January 13 2005 : 11:02:59 PM
Lonewolf,
What an interesting and historical family tree you have!
Tell us some more of those wonderful stories.
|
| lonewolf |
Posted - January 13 2005 : 9:12:10 PM
P.S. Only some of my posts. |
| lonewolf |
Posted - January 13 2005 : 9:07:19 PM
I don't understand why my posts on the Mohican Board are out there somewhere in cyberspace, even though I hit the "Submit Reply" box?
Are you having problems with the website? |
| lonewolf |
Posted - January 13 2005 : 9:00:35 PM
Hi Bookworm,
Another of my white ancestors was Robert Morris, delegate from Pennsylvania, who signed the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. I believe that he is the only person to sign all three. Robert came to a sad end in Pittsburgh.
He is buried in Philadelphia in the same grave as his friend Benjamin Franklin. Talk about "togetherness"!
Also, two of my Chambers ancestors served with Gen. George Washington at the very cold winter at Valley Forge. One of them was with Washington when they crossed the ice-choked Delaware River on Christmas eve and assaulted the Hessians at Trenton, N.J. He was given a set of pistols by Washington for his valor in that battle, our first victory of the American Revolution. My Oneida ancestors broke with the Iroquois Confederation (British allies), and supplied food to Washington's Army at Valley Forge. I have many interesting family stories, as both sides of my family participated in the early formation of this United States. We were killing each other (white and Indian) in the French and Indian War, the Revolution, and the War of 1812, but are all family today. We haved stood shoulder to shoulder in every war since then. Many paid the ultimate price for the freedoms that we enjoy today. My Shawnee relatives would appreciate it if Pennsylvania would give us back a few acres of our land near Pittsburgh, on which to practise our ancient culture and ceremonies. I will not be holding my breath on that one!
I will try to make the 1755 Braddock re-enactment at Fort Bedford this coming summer. |
| Bookworm |
Posted - January 12 2005 : 10:03:31 PM
I know there's an odd local pronunciation, but I'm not sure what it is. Thanks for sharing the info on your ancestry, Lonewolf! My husband worked in Chambersburg for a number of years, so that's why I know a little bit about Benjamin Chambers, but only a little. |
| lonewolf |
Posted - January 12 2005 : 12:50:01 AM
By the way, I have always been told that Conococheaque is pronounced as
"Conny-go-gig". That may not have been the correct pronunciation, just the one used by the Scot-Irish locals. |
| lonewolf |
Posted - January 11 2005 : 11:48:47 PM
Bookworm,
Col. Benjamin Chambers was first married to a Sarah Patterson, and his second wife was Jane Williams, whom is my white 5x great-grandmother. They had four sons, James, William, George, and Ezekial.
Ezekial is said to have founded Chambersville, Indiana County, Penna. |
| lonewolf |
Posted - January 11 2005 : 10:23:20 PM
Bookworm,
I have the family genealogy on the Chambers that I will share with you.
They came from Antrim County in Ireland in the early 1700's. |
| lonewolf |
Posted - January 11 2005 : 10:18:48 PM
Hi Bookworm,
Old Ben Chambers who founded Falling Springs (now Chambersburg, Pa.) is my white 5x great-grandfather. He didn't like Indians too well, since one of his sons was either killed or captured by them. They never found out which. Ben's son Ezekial Chambers is my 4x great-grandfather.
I sprinkled tobacco on their graves during my last visit to Chambersburg. |
| Wilderness Woman |
Posted - January 11 2005 : 08:50:15 AM
Well, I would too!!  Don't blame her a bit!
That is very cool.
|
| Fitz Williams |
Posted - January 11 2005 : 12:19:41 AM
My 5g-grandfather that came from Penn. was William Anderson, who was married to Rebecca Denny, both of Ireland. We have not been able to trace the Williams line before the early 18th century in SC. They married into some Douglass, Stuart, and McCardell famlies who arrived in SC around the 1790's, so maybe they came at about that time also. Don't know. There is a book in the local library about family histories in this area that has the details I need on William Anderson. We had copied some pages from it, but I can't find them now. Guess we will have to do the leg work again. I never thought about a F&I War connection there, but I would really like to find one.
And by the way, WW, William and Rebecca had a daughter, Sallie (married to a William Bracken), who entertained George Washington when he visited Charleston, and she talked about it for the rest of her life! |
| Bookworm |
Posted - January 10 2005 : 6:11:18 PM
Yes indeed, it's now spelled Conococheague, and runs through Franklin County in south-central PA (county seat Chambersburg, west of Gettysburg, east of Bedford), down through Maryland, emptying into the Potomac at Williamsburg, MD. The area was settled, mostly by Scotch-Irish, in the 1730s. The founder of Chambersburg was one Benjamin Chambers, who in 1748 married Jane Williams, daughter of a Welsh Episcopal clergyman of Virginia. Is it the Williams side of your family that hails from PA? I'm taking this info from "Chambersburg: Frontier Town, 1730-1794." If ever you want me to poke around in the local history books, Fitz, just let me know. And for any Scotsmen reading this, I just noticed in the book that another early settler was William McDowell "of the fighting stock of the Clan Argyle." |
| SgtMunro |
Posted - January 10 2005 : 5:00:28 PM
quote:
Fitz Willams asked: I have no idea where Connechocheauge Creek is located.
Why that is part of the 'stomping grounds' of none other than Seamus and Many Flags... Two of the toughest Berks County Long-Hunters to ever roam Penn's Woods. Chances are your ancestor might have been one of the civilan contractors for General Braddock, since there were not that many grist mills along the proposed Pennsylvania spur of Braddock's Road.
Your lineage gives you a better connection to the Braddock Expedition then mine. Members of my family were serving as Soldiers of the King at that time... King Fredrick of Prussia.
Your Most Humble Servant,
|
| Fitz Williams |
Posted - January 10 2005 : 01:26:56 AM
quote:
That's pretty cool, which mill was it? Was he one of the 'Pennsylvania Magazine' contractors for the Braddock Expedition?
Well, I finally found some of the paperwork on my 5g-grandfather who lived in Penn. I still haven't found the really good detail, but what I have says that he was born in 1706, moved to America in 1742, and settled in Penn. and had a mill on the Connechocheauge Creek. He moved to SC in 1763, so he would have been in Penn. for the duration of the F&I War. I have no idea where Connechocheauge Creek is located. The "good" papers I haven't found go into much more detail on that period of his life. |
| SgtMunro |
Posted - January 09 2005 : 11:26:52 AM
quote:
Okwaho asks: Sgt.Munro,Has the July 23-24 date for the Braddock's defeat event at Bedford,Pa.as shown by Smoke and Fire been firmed up yet?
Why yes it has. I look forward to seeing you there, and I will post all of the information (Concerning registration, the battle, etc.) within the next six weeks.
Your Most Humble Servant,
|
| Okwaho |
Posted - January 09 2005 : 12:23:45 AM
Does she have an authenticity nazi yellow armband Fitz?I just wonder if ANY Indians will show up at Manskers this year.I'll be there with the kids to see friends and maybe shop but if you want to see me dressed out,you'll need to bring your ice skates and a portable air conditioner.I don't know just what they're trying to prove but they're now on a par with the NPS as far as I'm concerned.Come on up to Pennsylvania in July.You can be our white friend and stay with us in the Native camp and we will welcome you as a brother and smoke the pipe together.The red coats of the Anglais will make good targets,morte les chien Anglais.
Tom |
| Fitz Williams |
Posted - January 08 2005 : 11:17:55 PM
quote:
Fitz,if you'll shave the moustache and learn to wear a breech clout etc we can find you a place in the Indian camp so you can move up in the world.
Well, the moustashe is a Williams family tradition that precedes the NWA (War of Northern Aggression), so it's not going anywhere. And I do wear a breech clout when my wife is not around (she has a problem with that). But I don't have a drop of Indian blood, and I don't think its right to do Indian if you are that white. Maybe Metis, Engage, or the ever popular CDB. But Milice works for me. It's just that there were not a lot of Milice in SC, but when on the road, well . . . And with Milice, I can still wear a breech clout and wool leggins (if the wife is not around), and breeches and long gaiters (when she is), and get to carry those "cool Tulle" guns, and wear my tuque and my new $270 French knife. Oh, and my wife would fit in well with the Board of Directors at Manskers. |
| Okwaho |
Posted - January 07 2005 : 11:54:41 PM
Sgt.Munro,Has the July 23-24 date for the Braddock's defeat event at Bedford,Pa.as shown by Smoke and Fire been firmed up yet?I'll be at Fort Ti but haven't made up my mind yet on Niagara and have thought about Crown Point.Coming out of the South I can make only so many Northern events.Has there been much Native response?I didn't make it to Necessity but went to Quebec instead.I just couldn't turn down the opportunity to canp and fight on the Plains of Abraham instead of shooting at trees and goblins etc at Necessity.Fitz,if you'll shave the moustache and learn to wear a breech clout etc we can find you a place in the Indian camp so you can move up in the world.
Tom Patton,Okwaho |
| lonewolf |
Posted - January 07 2005 : 10:40:57 PM
We didn't pick the wrong side! We used the French to keep the English landgrabbers out of the Ohio-Allegheny Valley. When we killed the English, we stuffed dirt in their mouths since they were "landhungry". Bon Apetit! This is not a "forgotten war" with we Shawnees. The taste still lingers in our mouths. Our land was stolen. The Iroquois sold it out from under us, something else that we have not forgotten. Two hundred and fidty years is recent history to people who have been here for at least forty thousand years.
And we are still in western Pennsylvania in considerable numbers. Along with our Munsee brothers. We have not forgotten, far from it!
This war forced us to side with the British in the Revolution, since the victorious colonials moved onto our lands in record numbers.
We sided with Pontiac to stem the white flow after the French and Indian War.
For my Shawnee people, the French and Indian War extended into the War of 1812 with no breaks in between. The 1790's were particularly brutal in western Pennsylvania. My white 5x great grandfather was killed in battle with my Shawnee people. My white red-haired, blue eyed, Scot 4x great grandmother was captured in western Maryland during the French and Indiian War. During prisoner exchanges, she chose to stay with the Shawnee.
Ironically, George Washington is in my wife's family tree. Along with Thomas Lee who founded the Ohio Company out of Williamsburg, Virginia. This is the man who sent his cousin, George Washington to western Pennsylvania to steal our land.
Forgotten war? Not forgotten by my family! We lost far too much to forget.
I will try to make Bedford. My ancestors were in the real thing in 1755 near Fort Dusquesne. My wife's ancestral cousin, as well (George Washington). I sometimes wonder what would have happened to American history if my ancestors had been better marksmen at that engagement? There would have been massive bloodstains on George's coat, rather than just a few holes torn by musket balls.
General Braddock was certainly the wrong man to be leading an army, at the wrong place, at the wrong time. It wasn't a massacre so much as it was simply an overwhelming victory against an army led by an incompetent man. One of the lessons learned by Washington at this battle was the fact that Indians weren't as stupid as he thought they were. |
| Fitz Williams |
Posted - January 07 2005 : 12:22:29 AM
quote:
That's pretty cool, which mill was it?
Gotta find the paperwork my wife did a few years back. We moved twice and some things are still packed away. I asked a lady at work who was originally from Penn. about it, and she knew where it was. Sort of a difficult name to remember, though. I will dig the papers out. It's time I did. The mill must have been worth some money, because when I moved to SC he bought land for his two oldest sons and himself and they all built houses. Unfortunately, their houses were all burned in the Rev War and he was killed. |
| SgtMunro |
Posted - January 06 2005 : 11:04:26 PM
quote:
Quote from Seamus: Duncan--make sure I am on your contact list. I am too far away to be involved in planning, etc. Thanks!
On that you can depend. Now that the gremlins (and not the variety made by AMC in the 1970's) are out of my PC, I will be sending you some updates on the whole event.
quote:
Quote from Fitz Williams: Sounds interesting. My ancestors came from Penn. My 5g-grandfather owned a grist mill there.
That's pretty cool, which mill was it? Was he one of the 'Pennsylvania Magazine' contractors for the Braddock Expedition?
Your Most Humble Servant,
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